Family's statement on toddler's cruise death

[Jasonmom]

I've read more than one person say that we will know exactly what happened once we see the video.  I wouldn't think they will ever show the video of this tragic event.  I doubt we will ever know the full story.  I doubt after this story is over a month old it will ever be in the news again.  Just my thoughts.

 

 

[UFMOM]

4 minutes ago, Jasonmom said:

I've read more than one person say that we will know exactly what happened once we see the video.  I wouldn't think they will ever show the video of this tragic event.  I doubt we will ever know the full story.  I doubt after this story is over a month old it will ever be in the news again.  Just my thoughts.

 

 

 

I agree, we may eventually hear a more accurate verbal account of this but that’s all. I think there will be a non disclosure settlement by Royal in which they state they are accepting no responsibility for the accident. But Royal will want this publicity to go away as quickly as possible. The video will be buried. I would like to know the true story, but I would never want to see that video. This story is haunting me enough as it is.

 

Mary Ann

[Minoushka]

I looked at RCI. No more info re the tragedy with that  child inSJU ..first of all those windows are high up ...yes they should be open to  let air in.who in their right mind puts a kid on a  railing .Of course it was a dreadful accident and tragedy ..but to blame the cruise line is shameful for wanting to  make a buck on this little girls death .sorry Grandpa ...take responsibility ...she wiggled out of your arms ....sad but true .Why would you think a ship was like an ice hockey rink ?why put her  on a railing ?did you not read about anyone being over railings ....to so quickly bring  a lawyer into this tragedy does not augur well ....With little kids one has to be extra  vigilant ...look for dangers everywhere and be ever mindful ofrules 

i.m sorry this happened but RCI is not to blame 

[Newleno]

"The police chief of South Bend, Indiana, Scott Ruszkowski, disputed the statement issued by Puerto Rico police that the girl was being held out of a window in an interview with WSBT television"  

The Puerto Rico police statements vs the lawyer for the family statements do not mesh.

[Marine Mom]

On 7/10/2019 at 1:01 PM, IrieBajan54 said:

Even if he isn't prosecuted, he will not be invited to anymore Thanksgiving dinners.

That's for sure!

[graphicguy]

1 hour ago, Newleno said:

"The police chief of South Bend, Indiana, Scott Ruszkowski, disputed the statement issued by Puerto Rico police that the girl was being held out of a window in an interview with WSBT television"  

The Puerto Rico police statements vs the lawyer for the family statements do not mesh.

Yeah....here comes the spin.  I don’t see how anyone in South Bend can even dispute anything.  Last I checked, South Bend isn’t in Puerto Rico.

[Newleno]

Reports from Puerto Rico indicate some members of the family will have to return to Puerto Rico on July 24 for more questioning (The Puerto Rico authorities are waiting until after the funeral)

[graphicguy]

The Grandfather’s original statement.....

 

”The toddler and her family were on the 11th floor pool deck enjoying sweeping views of San Juan. Her grandfather, Salvatore Anello, told cops he was holding her up to a window when he lost his grip and she accidentally slipped out of his arms.”

 

Now, they’re changing the story with the Grandfather stating he didn’t do any of that.

 

Just admit it was a terrible accident, move on.  If there are legal ramifications for GrandPa, lawyer up then.  He hasn’t been charged (yet).  

[Newleno]

5 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

The Grandfather’s original statement.....

 

”The toddler and her family were on the 11th floor pool deck enjoying sweeping views of San Juan. Her grandfather, Salvatore Anello, told cops he was holding her up to a window when he lost his grip and she accidentally slipped out of his arms.”

 

Now, they’re changing the story with the Grandfather stating he didn’t do any of that.

 

Just admit it was a terrible accident, move on.  If there are legal ramifications for GrandPa, lawyer up then.  He hasn’t been charged (yet).  

The various video angles from the ships security has been reviewed by the Puerto Rico authorities so hopefully the truth as to what exactly happened will be factually determined.

[graphicguy]

I’ve sailed the Liberty of the Seas.  I know where those windows are.  You would definitely have to lift a toddler up to look/bang on the top ones.  And, you’d be missing most of your senses if you didn’t know they were open.

 

But, the bottom area of windows, where the toddler could have looked out/banged on are fixed.

 

So, the Grandfather HAD TO lift the child up to the top windows, and had to see/feel/observe it being open (if he didn’t actually open it himself, which is what I think happened).  He probably sat her on the window ledge (which is quite narrow to begin with).  The toddler couldn’t balance herself, leaned forward, or just lunged, resulting in the tragedy.

 

The spin just makes no sense.  But, Royal is going to have to defend themselves, maybe to the point of pressing for criminal charges against the Grandfather to alleviate them of any liability.

 

If the Grandfather and family would be left to grieve and move on instead of hiring a lawyer, this would probably be the end of it.  That’s not the way they obviously want to proceed, however.

[PTC DAWG]

1 hour ago, Newleno said:

Reports from Puerto Rico indicate some members of the family will have to return to Puerto Rico on July 24 for more questioning (The Puerto Rico authorities are waiting until after the funeral)

Good luck with that.  

[graphicguy]

2 minutes ago, PTC DAWG said:

Good luck with that.  

Assuming a subpoena from a U.S. Territory carries the same mandate to appear as it does in the upper 50 states?

[Don'tNeedAName]

22 minutes ago, PTC DAWG said:

Good luck with that.  

 

May not be a matter of luck for the grandfather if charged or anyone who is formally subpoenaed and fails to appear.  See 18 U.S.C. § 3182 and Puerto Rico v. Branstad, 483 U.S. 219 (1987).  Extradition applies to Puerto Rico, and the governor of Indiana (assuming they remain there) generally would be required to satisfy a request from Puerto Rico authorities to deliver the parties at issue.

 

Edit: oops, somehow missed graphicguy's post.

Edited July 12, 2019 by Don'tNeedAName

[Newleno]

39 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

I’ve sailed the Liberty of the Seas.  I know where those windows are.  You would definitely have to lift a toddler up to look/bang on the top ones.  And, you’d be missing most of your senses if you didn’t know they were open.

 

But, the bottom area of windows, where the toddler could have looked out/banged on are fixed.

 

So, the Grandfather HAD TO lift the child up to the top windows, and had to see/feel/observe it being open (if he didn’t actually open it himself, which is what I think happened).  He probably sat her on the window ledge (which is quite narrow to begin with).  The toddler couldn’t balance herself, leaned forward, or just lunged, resulting in the tragedy.

 

The spin just makes no sense.  But, Royal is going to have to defend themselves, maybe to the point of pressing for criminal charges against the Grandfather to alleviate them of any liability.

 

If the Grandfather and family would be left to grieve and move on instead of hiring a lawyer, this would probably be the end of it.  That’s not the way they obviously want to proceed, however.

Yes the spin just makes no sense, I have been trying to find freedom of the seas videos of the area in question, actually found one with a law officer at the window, the officer is leaning on the railing which puts him over the window ledge.  A cursory look at the few videos I have found indicate that the railing is very close to the window, a cursory observation indicates that the only way a child could be sitting on the railing is if the window was open, otherwise the child would have been to close to the window and actually hit the window being unable to sit because the window was in the way. (unless the grandfather  had the child standing on the railing?, ) All just preliminary, wish we could get a detailed different angles video from someone who is on the ship now of the railing area. 

Edited July 12, 2019 by Newleno

[GeezerCouple]

2 hours ago, graphicguy said:

Yeah....here comes the spin.  I don’t see how anyone in South Bend can even dispute anything.  Last I checked, South Bend isn’t in Puerto Rico.

 

Wasn't the father (not Grandfather) a local Police Officer?  No surprise the other officers are rallying around the *family* vs. the cruise line...

 

GC

[Gopherpharm]

On 7/11/2019 at 10:48 AM, jenf22 said:

You know, I was thinking this at first too.  But after looking at the pictures I'm wondering a couple of things - 1) How could he have put her up there so perfectly that an arm or leg didn't pass through the opening revealing there was no glass?  The ledge is only a couple of inches  and 2) the windows don't look very tall.  I know she was little, but wouldn't she have been taller than the opening?  Wouldn't he have hit her head if he stood her in the window?

 

So I really think it was just a horrible accident and the lawyer is trying to convince them it wasn't totally the grandpa's fault.  It's got to be a much easier "truth" for the family to handle right now.  So so sad.

1) Agree but perhaps this realization occurred as she was leaning forward/slipping out of his grip

2) the windows are at least 3 feet tall and if she was over 3 feet at 18 months that would be extremely abnormal

 

I agree that was a horrible accident. 

[AmazedByCruising]

I feel sorry for grandpa. He obviously was just trying to make it more fun for the child, and the way he did that turned out to be a very bad idea. I've read more posts on this site about people sitting on railings and even putting their kids on railings. Many people simply happen to be stupid. I doubt giving a penalty for being stupid, as the person who did it probably didn't even understand that he was, has any function. Lawyers and strategies like blaming the line, when you need to bury your child, it all just makes a very sad situation even worse. 

[PTC DAWG]

2 hours ago, graphicguy said:

Assuming a subpoena from a U.S. Territory carries the same mandate to appear as it does in the upper 50 states?

The same Puerto Rico that I visited recently, saw them give two on duty Cops very strong Pina Coladas...both toting guns, both sitting at the bar laughing about it...this was in Old Town....bartender said they were regulars.  🙂

 

When I got to USVI St Thomas, I was talking to the police there about it while waiting on the shuttle to Water Island, he said Puerto Rico is a different animal.  

[HNI]

On 7/11/2019 at 8:52 AM, CarnivalCruiser32 said:

sorry (not sorry) but your way of thinking is what keeps people in prison for minor infractions (just an example) for extended amounts of time wasting tax payer dollars and lets other very guilty people walk free bc our prisons are too overcrowded to keep them

People in prison are convicted felons, not individuals who commit "minor infractions."

[Ideb]

From what I first read, I thought the people had just got on the ship so the incident happened during daytime and as so many people commented on here, it would be easy to tell if the window was open.

 

However, on a video I just watched of an interview with the lawyer, they were showing pictures of the police on the deck after it happened and it was night and the windows were all dark and there were lights from buildings outside showing and it made it look like it was hard to see if the window was open (although I would think there would still be a breeze coming through an opening). Does anyone know what time of day this happened?

Just wondering if the lawyer is showing pictures of the police there much later trying to give the impression it was dark outside and the grandfather couldn't tell if was open due to the darkness.

 

This is what it showed during the interview with the lawyer.

[Shidah]

Approx 5 pm

[Two Wheels Only]

37 minutes ago, Shidah said:

Approx 5 pm

 

Which was about 2 hours before sunset. Plenty of daylight. 

[xcell]

There was an article that said the parents declined to view the video of the accident and that the GF declined to make a statement.

 

Not that they should but I guess there is video proof of what really happened or at least would shed more light.

Edited July 13, 2019 by xcell

[mitsugirly]

On 7/12/2019 at 11:15 AM, Newleno said:

Yes the spin just makes no sense, I have been trying to find freedom of the seas videos of the area in question, actually found one with a law officer at the window, the officer is leaning on the railing which puts him over the window ledge.  A cursory look at the few videos I have found indicate that the railing is very close to the window, a cursory observation indicates that the only way a child could be sitting on the railing is if the window was open, otherwise the child would have been to close to the window and actually hit the window being unable to sit because the window was in the way. (unless the grandfather  had the child standing on the railing?, ) All just preliminary, wish we could get a detailed different angles video from someone who is on the ship now of the railing area. 

 

We were just on the Freedom a few months ago. The windows bow out, like a slant from the floor up and then back in, right at the handrail:

 

 

You can definitely tell if a window is open due to the tinting of the windows.

 

 

 

 

Such a sad situation all around. My heart breaks for this family. 😞

 

[Barb Nahoumi]

I noticed windows that slide open on the Dawn's pool deck.  They were small.  If we were cruising with small kids, which we don't, no way would we get any kind of balcony cabin.  Only an Ocean View.