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Club Orange upgrade offer - on R class ship

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53 minutes ago, AncientWanderer said:

To me, seems as if Club Orange is just another extra revenue stream and has very little to do with the suites.  The few times we've booked NS, we've observed many of the folks in the Lounge have other special requirements that necessitate having a bit larger stateroom -- disabilities and such.  Not all, but many.  Or they have a third guest in the room, so want extra space. Those are customers that can be counted on, so HAL doesn't really need to up their suite offerings too much to fill those rooms. 

 

 I don't really have any expectation that there will be a special restaurant just for suite guests.  Heck, I was sad last month when we didn't even get our printed stationery. 

That's possible but it's also possible that those who would prefer a suites lounge/dining area know that they have to go to X/RCCI/NCL to get one.

 

And, yes, HAL is reducing amenities.  Perhaps adding a suites lounge/dining would be a way to reverse the trend.

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I agree that HAL is taking away little things that make the cruise special. Yes, CO is a revenue stream, but not much compared to what they could charge for the Suites if they had value. Celebrity has doubled their Suite offerings on their new ships and they are not focused on the wheelchair set. But they also provide valuable perks. That is where, I think, HAL is very short sighted and "missing the boat". We also are very active and don't need physical assistance. 

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1 minute ago, twodjs said:

I agree that HAL is taking away little things that make the cruise special. Yes, CO is a revenue stream, but not much compared to what they could charge for the Suites if they had value. Celebrity has doubled their Suite offerings on their new ships and they are not focused on the wheelchair set. But they also provide valuable perks. That is where, I think, HAL is very short sighted and "missing the boat". We also are very active and don't need physical assistance. 

 

CO is not the revenue stream HAL had hoped for. Initially they announced a price of $50 pppd. Now the "list price" is $35 on Pinnacle ships and $25 on others. And here we have the offer to some passengers for $15 on a non-Pinnacle ship.

 

We've all seen pictures of the CO on the Pinnacle ships, but there isn't much info on how CO has been implemented on other ships. It's slowly creeping out through the fleet, but we don't know how. If it's just priority seating withing the MDR and a separate menu, HAL could accept failure and drop CO from the non-Pinnacles. If they construct a separate space within the MDR, then they're stuck with it. Unless they repurpose it as a suite dining room or some other upsell dining venue. 

 

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Posted (edited)
On 8/23/2019 at 1:06 AM, twodjs said:

Well except for laundry and restaurant discounts, those other perks given to CO guests WERE the perks reserved for 4 star or suite guests. HAL already offered fewer perks than every other major cruise line and now, rather than catch up and offer real value to their best customers, they do this. We are 4 star also. And they slapped our faces hard. As a result, we have 4 cruises coming up within the year - none on HAL.

 

 

 

 

Our exodus is underway as well albeit not until 2021.

Edited by KirkNC

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8 hours ago, terrydtx said:

On our July Noordam cruise we decided to try Canaletto Italian restaurant after a terrible experience on the N. Amsterdam, and it was so much better than before. For the price I would  now make it my second favorite specialty restaurant on HAL. We heard a lot of complaints from others on the cruise about the PG and at $39pp it is not worth the cost. Not surprisingly the PG was mostly empty every time we passed it during dinner hours. 

 

We also enjoy Canaletto.  After the 2019 WC we gave Pinnacle a scathing review.  We only went a handful of times and the problems were extensive, 2 to 2.5 hours to eat dinner, poor service, special requests forgotten (two separate times), steaks improperly cooked, salmon WAY over cooked (I swear they cooked it all day), steak quality has fallen off significantly since they changed vendors.  We get two free dinners per bookings, if not for that we would not even go.

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36 minutes ago, KirkNC said:

 

We also enjoy Canaletto.  After the 2019 WC we gave Pinnacle a scathing review.  We only went a handful of times and the problems were extensive, 2 to 2.5 hours to eat dinner, poor service, special requests forgotten (two separate times), steaks improperly cooked, salmon WAY over cooked (I swear they cooked it all day), steak quality has fallen off significantly since they changed vendors.  We get two free dinners per bookings, if not for that we would not even go.

 

 

Now, this truly does baffle me. While I can see where market analysis might not lead to a "suites-only" dining room, I can't for the life of me understand why HAL's specialty restaurants aren't given more attention.

Every single cruise line we've sailed with has had excellent specialty dining, so there has to be money to be made in that area.  Yet HAL seems to just use PG as a "giveaway" for this or that promotion.  It's inexplicable, given Carnival's attention to specialty restaurants on its other lines.  So odd.

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Not sure why HAL needs to add more specialty dining, suite lounges/dining rooms as has been one of the focuses of discussion on this thread.  Their relatively smaller ships do not allow it and when HAL does try to shoehorn in something, it is often an aftermarket black eye.

 

HAL has always been a follower, not an innovator, yes.  But HAL's market is what it is.  They seem to be doing just fine.  Do all lines have or need a waterslide, a skating rink, a climbing wall?  HAL

has a decent product with the emphasis on service and beautifully designed ships.  Suits many pax.

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5 minutes ago, SilvertoGold said:

Not sure why HAL needs to add more specialty dining, suite lounges/dining rooms as has been one of the focuses of discussion on this thread.  Their relatively smaller ships do not allow it and when HAL does try to shoehorn in something, it is often an aftermarket black eye.

 

HAL has always been a follower, not an innovator, yes.  But HAL's market is what it is.  They seem to be doing just fine.  Do all lines have or need a waterslide, a skating rink, a climbing wall?  HAL

has a decent product with the emphasis on service and beautifully designed ships.  Suits many pax.

Very misleading to attempt to equate a suites lounge/dining to waterslides or skating rinks.   Compare the prices charged by X/RCCI/NCL for their suites to those charged by HAL and tell me again about how HAL is "doing just fine".  

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6 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Very misleading to attempt to equate a suites lounge/dining to waterslides or skating rinks.   Compare the prices charged by X/RCCI/NCL for their suites to those charged by HAL and tell me again about how HAL is "doing just fine".  

 

In general terms each line has its market.  Some want waterslides, some don't.   Pay for a suite on X and get a lounge and dining room.  On HAL, you don't.  Pick and choose.

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23 minutes ago, SilvertoGold said:

They seem to be doing just fine.  

 

I wonder if people said HAL was doing just fine when it had to be bought by Carnival to keep them from going under?

 

I haven’t seen a breakdown on the CCL financials as to how HAL is doing so I don’t think we know.

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3 minutes ago, kazu said:

 

I wonder if people said HAL was doing just fine when it had to be bought by Carnival to keep them from going under?

 

I haven’t seen a breakdown on the CCL financials as to how HAL is doing so I don’t think we know.

 

Wasn't that a awfully long time ago?  I am thinking about customer satisfaction overall.

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7 minutes ago, SilvertoGold said:

 

Wasn't that a awfully long time ago?  I am thinking about customer satisfaction overall.

Perhaps, but if you want to judge satisfaction of suites customers, compare the availability of suites on celebrity and those on Holland.   I've been looking at 10-11 day Caribbean cruises on Celebrity.  Some categories already sold out for 2021.  Even with higher pricing, Celebrity seems to do better.  Holland seems to rely upon paid upgrades to move their suites, Celebrity seems to get full value.

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4 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Perhaps, but if you want to judge satisfaction of suites customers, compare the availability of suites on celebrity and those on Holland.   I've been looking at 10-11 day Caribbean cruises on Celebrity.  Some categories already sold out for 2021.  Even with higher pricing, Celebrity seems to do better.  Holland seems to rely upon paid upgrades to move their suites, Celebrity seems to get full value.

 

Does HAL or any line really put all their eggs in the suite basket?  Are Suite pax that important?  I would have though any line would want to satisfy all their pax. 

 

So few pax per ship in suites relative to so many not in suites. Have you added up the income for suite and non-suite accommodation for an average ship?

 

 

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44 minutes ago, SilvertoGold said:

 

Does HAL or any line really put all their eggs in the suite basket?  Are Suite pax that important?  I would have though any line would want to satisfy all their pax. 

 

So few pax per ship in suites relative to so many not in suites. Have you added up the income for suite and non-suite accommodation for an average ship?

 

No one is saying HAL should put all the eggs in one basket. Obviously X/RCCI/NCL/etc., consider their suites passengers important additions to their bottom line.  Compare the prices X/RCCI/NCL/etc and their occupancy rates to HAL.    HAL like any business needs to maximize revenue and offering suites lounge/dining would appear to offer revenue enhancing opportunities.  

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On 8/22/2019 at 9:11 AM, twodjs said:

I agree completely! That is why I hated the program from the start. Show no respect to the loyal customers or the suite customers. Great way to blow it, HAL.

My wife doesn't like this either. Four star Mariners and 90% of our cruises have been on HAL. 

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Just off Oosterdam..... Forget it. Only perk was expedited seating dining room, 1 additional entre on menu, no designated seating area. Seated with regular diners, bit awkward 

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1 hour ago, SVBing said:

Just off Oosterdam..... Forget it. Only perk was expedited seating dining room, 1 additional entre on menu, no designated seating area. Seated with regular diners, bit awkward 

 

Oh, no!   What can HAL possibly be thinking?  That would be so weird eating something that nobody else can order.

Entree envy!  Thumbs down!

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1 hour ago, SVBing said:

Just off Oosterdam..... Forget it. Only perk was expedited seating dining room, 1 additional entre on menu, no designated seating area. Seated with regular diners, bit awkward 

 

Thank you for your report.  This will be a no-go for me.  Definitely nothing of value there.

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2 hours ago, SVBing said:

Just off Oosterdam..... Forget it. Only perk was expedited seating dining room, 1 additional entre on menu, no designated seating area. Seated with regular diners, bit awkward 

Yes, this does sound awkward.  What is HAL thinking!!!???

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6 minutes ago, FlorenceItaly said:

 What is HAL thinking!!!???

Maybe they weren't ....

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3 hours ago, SVBing said:

Just off Oosterdam..... Forget it. Only perk was expedited seating dining room, 1 additional entre on menu, no designated seating area. Seated with regular diners, bit awkward 

 

Thanks for reporting back. Seated at the same table (MEGA awkward) or at tables near non-CO pax (still awkward but less so)? Were they including Neptune/Pinnacle suite passengers in the CO extra item?

 

46 minutes ago, rucrazy said:

Maybe they weren't ....

 

MAYBE????????????? It was sort of a natural on the Pinnacle ships. I can imagine the discussion. Underused space, hmm, how can we monetize this, and CO was born. Then someone said, "OK, that's great! People are gonna love it. Can't wait until it goes fleetwide!" And at a later meeting, someone asked in a tiny voice, "Um, how do we do CO on the other ships?" And there was silence in the room.

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The two new ships have I believe 10 less NS than R class (much smaller ships). IMO looks like HAL is moving away from the suite market.

Feels to me like they want to pack in more staterooms and sell a "lucky few" the CO package to make them feel "special".

Would hate to see HAL become the Ryan Air of the Carnival companies.

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1 minute ago, frankc98376 said:

The two new ships have I believe 10 less NS than R class (much smaller ships). IMO looks like HAL is moving away from the suite market.

Feels to me like they want to pack in more staterooms and sell a "lucky few" the CO package to make them feel "special".

Would hate to see HAL become the Ryan Air of the Carnival companies.

 

They were definitely marketing CO to make people feel "special." That was the corporate spiel. I was in a NS on the K when CO was new. I commented to my steward that I wasn't excited about getting CO and he said "It's a new amenity to make our suite passengers feel special." When I checked in at Port Everglades, the line manager looked at my ticket and walked me to the SPECIAL orange mat that said "Club Orange." The person there greeted me and walked me to behind the main check-in area to my very own SPECIAL private check-in location. Not really private, as it faced the enormous waiting area. But it was SPECIAL because I didn't have anyone standing in line behind me or at a check-in desk next to me. You get a distinctive (SPECIAL!) tote bag. You get to stand on a Club Orange mat at the front desk because SPECIAL people get priority service. 

 

I don't care if they want to sell extra amenities to people willing to pay for them. I dislike the "you are so SPECIAL" marketing approach that feeds the ego. 

 

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7 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

They were definitely marketing CO to make people feel "special." That was the corporate spiel. I was in a NS on the K when CO was new. I commented to my steward that I wasn't excited about getting CO and he said "It's a new amenity to make our suite passengers feel special." When I checked in at Port Everglades, the line manager looked at my ticket and walked me to the SPECIAL orange mat that said "Club Orange." The person there greeted me and walked me to behind the main check-in area to my very own SPECIAL private check-in location. Not really private, as it faced the enormous waiting area. But it was SPECIAL because I didn't have anyone standing in line behind me or at a check-in desk next to me. You get a distinctive (SPECIAL!) tote bag. You get to stand on a Club Orange mat at the front desk because SPECIAL people get priority service. 

 

I don't care if they want to sell extra amenities to people willing to pay for them. I dislike the "you are so SPECIAL" marketing approach that feeds the ego. 

 

 

I was certified as a 'Special' Education Teacher and taught "Special needs" students. I think everyone is special in their own way and I invested a lot of time trying to help parents and others look past the labels placed on the children and see them for who they really were. I found that the various labels did more harm than good.

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