Now that the CDC is not going to require vaccines, would you want to cruise right away?

[M&A]

13 minutes ago, broadwaybaby123 said:

I actually cancelled my August cruise over this.  My family and I are fully vaccinated (except for one child under the age of 12), but we don't feel comfortable going until we know all the mitigation strategies work.

 

Of course we will comply with all requirements as necessary.  We are still planning on going on our November and Feb. cruises, both aboard Anthem.

But if you are fully vaccinated why would you feel uncomfortable?  Moderna and Pzier are now 94% and 95% effective. 

If you are only comfortable with only other vaccinated passengers then what about port stops?  

  

Edited May 19, 2021 by M&A

[tserface]

On 5/18/2021 at 2:39 PM, Ocean Boy said:

You actually get all of those yearly as you posted?

No, just whenever my doctor says I'm due.  But, those are the ones I've gotten.

Tom

[tserface]

10 hours ago, Sunshine3601 said:

I think shingles vaccine is good for 5 years, tetanus is also good for several years as well as pneumonia vaccine. 

Your only annual vaccine is probably the flu shot.

Yeah I can't say how often.  My doctor tells me once a year, at my yearly checkup, which to get and either he does it there or sends me to the pharmacy to get them.  Those are just the ones I remember getting.

 

Tom

[tserface]

9 hours ago, M&A said:

But if you are fully vaccinated why would you feel uncomfortable?  Moderna and Pzier are now 94% and 95% effective. 

If you are only comfortable with only other vaccinated passengers then what about port stops?  

  

I'm not too worried about other people, but I think if the cruise lines require vaccinations, at least at first, they could protect themselves.  If a bunch of unprotected people got on the ship and there ended up being another run at an outbreak onboard, then the media would go crazy with it.  I feel safe, having been vaccinated, but I'd also like to not lose the privilege of cruising again.

There wasn't anything keeping me from getting vaccinated.  It didn't hurt, I didn't get any reaction, and Bill Gates already knows where I live.  My doctor highly recommended it ASAP, and I trust him so I went with it.

I can't wait to get back out on the ocean and put all this behind us. 

Tom

[Capt Stuebing]

The whole CDC orders are just plain confusing. We were told to wear masks to protect others. Now we’re told vaccinated people don’t have to wear masks. So does this mean the non vaccinated folks don’t need to be protected any longer? Confusing. 
 

Then we were also told airlines were safe to fly months ago because they had a special air flow & filtration system but now when masks can be removed, airline travel still require masks. Confusing to say the least. 
 

At this point I don’t believe anything that is stated or required by the CDC is actually following any form of science. 
 

We just all want to cruise safely and wish that someone would clearly offer a logical, reasonable, response to the industry so this can occur 

[Capt Stuebing]

58 minutes ago, tserface said:

I'm not too worried about other people, but I think if the cruise lines require vaccinations, at least at first, they could protect themselves.  If a bunch of unprotected people got on the ship and there ended up being another run at an outbreak onboard, then the media would go crazy with it.  I feel safe, having been vaccinated, but I'd also like to not lose the privilege of cruising again.

There wasn't anything keeping me from getting vaccinated.  It didn't hurt, I didn't get any reaction, and Bill Gates already knows where I live.  My doctor highly recommended it ASAP, and I trust him so I went with it.

I can't wait to get back out on the ocean and put all this behind us. 

Tom

But non vaccinated people at port stops can infect you just as much as the non vaccinated cruisers. So what difference does it make? And in either case should it occur, the media will still make it a mass hysteria type reporting 

[Capt Stuebing]

On 5/15/2021 at 3:13 PM, 3kidsncats said:

I prefer to be unmasked on a fully vaccinated ship, over masking in all public spaces with no vaccination required.

May I ask a few questions? 
... if the CDC did not require masks for cruise ships and did not require vaccinations as well, would you still feel the same? meaning is it just all about the masks or all about the vaccinations? 
 

Also, what about port stops? Are you concerned about the possibility of bringing Covid onto the ship from non vaccinated locals? 

[BOOKBOOKBOOK]

4 hours ago, Capt Stuebing said:

The whole CDC orders are just plain confusing. We were told to wear masks to protect others. Now we’re told vaccinated people don’t have to wear masks. So does this mean the non vaccinated folks don’t need to be protected any longer? Confusing. 
 

Then we were also told airlines were safe to fly months ago because they had a special air flow & filtration system but now when masks can be removed, airline travel still require masks. Confusing to say the least. 
 

At this point I don’t believe anything that is stated or required by the CDC is actually following any form of science. 
 

We just all want to cruise safely and wish that someone would clearly offer a logical, reasonable, response to the industry so this can occur 

 

Those who are not vaccinated (either by choice or because it's medically unsafe for them to do so) are being protected by those who are. The scientific method is being conducted by the day via numerous studies, and the latest science demonstrates that vaccinated people without a mask are just as good, if not better, at protecting unvaccinated folk than unvaccinated folk with a mask.

 

I fault the CDC heavily for being very opaque throughout the pandemic, especially with regards to cruise guidance, but to conclude that they are suggesting "non vaccinated folks don't need to be protected any longer" is a stretch.

 

As outlined by the CDC and pushed by big cruise lines (beating the CDC to the punch), vaccines are our ticket to cruising safely and normally. Norwegian challenged the CDC's strict CSO by committing to 100% vaccination and writing a letter to them about it. Celebrity just announced that vaccinated passengers will no longer need to mask up anywhere (as long as social distancing is possible).

 

I'm optimistic that we will receive updated, reasonable health protocols for the cruise industry, and this will happen sooner rather than later based on recent trends.

[BOOKBOOKBOOK]

4 hours ago, Capt Stuebing said:

But non vaccinated people at port stops can infect you just as much as the non vaccinated cruisers. So what difference does it make? And in either case should it occur, the media will still make it a mass hysteria type reporting 

 

The cruise lines don't have control over the vaccination status of foreign port residents. If infection does occur as a result of the port's inhabitants, the cruise lines can at least say to the media that they did their best by requiring passengers be vaccinated before boarding in the first place.

 

Non-vaccinated people at port stops can't infect you just as much as non-vaccinated cruisers because the majority of interactions with port residents are outdoors, and non-vaccinated cruisers share the same public spaces with vaccinated passengers for extended periods of time (days). This is an apples to oranges comparison.

[BOOKBOOKBOOK]

4 hours ago, Capt Stuebing said:

May I ask a few questions? 
... if the CDC did not require masks for cruise ships and did not require vaccinations as well, would you still feel the same? meaning is it just all about the masks or all about the vaccinations? 
 

Also, what about port stops? Are you concerned about the possibility of bringing Covid onto the ship from non vaccinated locals? 

 

It's all about the vaccinations. The CDC has provided a quicker path to US sailings for cruise lines with the 95%/98% vaccinated passengers/crew rule.

 

To bring in another perspective, if non-vaccinated locals are the cause of infection of vaccinated passengers, the likelihood of a Princess Diamond-esque outbreak is super low. The worst case scenario is that a handful of passengers will get infected, quarantined, and not die (due to vaccination protecting people from severe cases). Media backlash will be a fraction of what it was for the Princess outbreaks.

[Coralc]

16 hours ago, Sunshine3601 said:

I think shingles vaccine is good for 5 years, tetanus is also good for several years as well as pnuemonia vaccine. 

Your only annual vaccine is probably the flu shot.

Shingles is a once (2 shots) and done. DTAP is once. Tetanus booster is every 10 years. 

Edited May 20, 2021 by Coralc

[Coralc]

4 hours ago, Capt Stuebing said:

The whole CDC orders are just plain confusing. We were told to wear masks to protect others. Now we’re told vaccinated people don’t have to wear masks. So does this mean the non vaccinated folks don’t need to be protected any longer? Confusing. 
 

 

Non vaccinated people just need to be protected from each other. For vaccinated people, the non vaccinated people are not our problem anymore. 

[harkinmr]

6 hours ago, Coralc said:

 

Non vaccinated people just need to be protected from each other. For vaccinated people, the non vaccinated people are not our problem anymore. 

Agreed. When everyone has had the opportunity to be vaccinated and is either hesitating or is dug in on not getting vaccinated, then it is up to them to protect themselves.  The CDC was being pushed to move towards a normal life for vaccinated folks and has done just that. They would be criticized either way.  The unvaccinated are going to take advantage and throw off their masks (if they wore one in the first place 🙄) and then of course complain and criticize if there are localized outbreaks.
 

The cruise lines would be smart to go with the 95/98% cruises, with all unvaccinated passengers wearing masks.  Unvaccinated folks (including unvaccinated children) should not be allowed to freely explore ports. Cruises that do not meet the vaccinated percentages will have all of the limitations and protocols applied to them, as they should.  Cruise lines will make a choice and will not be trying to police or corral who is vaccinated or who is not. It’s would be unreasonable to make them do that.
 

The pandemic is still here no matter how much complaining and whining takes place, and if people choose to remain unvaccinated then that is on them.  If they want to cruise then live with the rules.  It’s a choice.  Make it. 

Edited May 20, 2021 by harkinmr

[Ocean Boy]

1 hour ago, harkinmr said:

Agreed. When everyone has had the opportunity to be vaccinated and is either hesitating or is dug in on not getting vaccinated, then it is up to them to protect themselves.  The CDC was being pushed to move towards a normal life for vaccinated folks and has done just that. They would be criticized either way.  The unvaccinated are going to take advantage and throw off their masks (if they wore one in the first place 🙄) and then of course complain and criticize if there are localized outbreaks.
 

The cruise lines would be smart to go with the 95/98% cruises, with all unvaccinated passengers wearing masks.  Unvaccinated folks (including unvaccinated children) should not be allowed to freely explore ports. Cruises that do not meet the vaccinated percentages will have all of the limitations and protocols applied to them, as they should.  Cruise lines will make a choice and will not be trying to police or corral who is vaccinated or who is not. It’s would be unreasonable to make them do that.
 

The pandemic is still here no matter how much complaining and whining takes place, and if people choose to remain unvaccinated then that is on them.  If they want to cruise then live with the rules.  It’s a choice.  Make it. 

I knew it it was just a matter of time until you and I agreed on something.😇

 

However, if cruise lines choose to go the unvaccinated route and that decision causes the vaccinated to have to adhere to masking, distancing, and port restriction protocols that they find unacceptable and would be unnecessary on a vaccinated ship, then the cruise lines should be prepared to issue refunds if the customer so desires.

[RFerrington]

40 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

However, if cruise lines choose to go the unvaccinated route and that decision causes the vaccinated to have to adhere to masking, distancing, and port restriction protocols that they find unacceptable and would be unnecessary on a vaccinated ship, then the cruise lines should be prepared to issue refunds if the customer so desires.

Conversely, hopefully Royal will provide full refunds to those of us who are not getting vaccinated, if we are not allowed to sail.  I think there are far fewer of us....so it may make the most sense, financially, for Royal to sail only vaccinated cruises - at least, at first.  It would be nice if Royal made some provisions like medical contradictions and prophylaxis (in lieu of vaccination), but I'm not holding my breath for that.

[not-enough-cruising]

8 hours ago, Coralc said:

Shingles is a once (2 shots) and done. DTAP is once. Tetanus booster is every 10 years. 

Actually DTap is a 10 year booster schedule. 

[3kidsncats]

16 hours ago, Capt Stuebing said:

May I ask a few questions? 
... if the CDC did not require masks for cruise ships and did not require vaccinations as well, would you still feel the same? meaning is it just all about the masks or all about the vaccinations? 
 

Also, what about port stops? Are you concerned about the possibility of bringing Covid onto the ship from non vaccinated locals? 

I probably wouldn’t sail if it was a combination of no masking AND vaccination not required.  I’m confident of the efficacy of the vaccine for those like me who have gotten it, but if unvaccinated passengers are onboard, unmasked, the the chances of trip disruption increase more than I prefer to deal with.  Obviously there is always a risk of disruption on any trip, but you weigh the potential risk for it, and base decisions on that perception.  So it’s not all about either issue, it’s about how the factors interact together to lower or increase risk.  
 

We are booked on Adventure out the Bahamas — so are definitely getting off on CocoCay where everyone will be vaccinated.  We are tentatively planning on staying onboard for the other two stops, but will make a final decision based on the numbers when we actually sail.  This decision is due to risk of variants — if we do opt to go ashore, we will mask and practice strict social distancing, as we have for the past 15 months, and continue to do in public areas.  

[tserface]

16 hours ago, Capt Stuebing said:

But non vaccinated people at port stops can infect you just as much as the non vaccinated cruisers. So what difference does it make? And in either case should it occur, the media will still make it a mass hysteria type reporting 

If everyone (or at least most) people on the cruises are vaccinated it's unlikely they will get sick, or at least very sick, while on the cruise so there's not really a lot to be afraid of while in port.  Also, I think the cruise lines plan to test even those who have been vaccinated to make sure they are not carrying when they return.  So, if we get off the cruise and back on, after being vaccinated, it's unlikely any symptoms will occur.

 

Tom

[MommaBear55]

12 hours ago, Coralc said:

Shingles is a once (2 shots) and done. DTAP is once. Tetanus booster is every 10 years. 

DTaP is tetanus with diptheria and pertussis. Done every 10 years, unless you gave a dirty injury and then it's after 5 years or if you are pregnant you get it every time you are pregnant because of the pertussis. And DTap is for youngsters, TDaP is for adults. 

[atgood]

IMO It’s a false presumption to automatically assume that an unvaccinated person will be much more likely to contract CV-19, and therefore make a cruise unsafe and ruin a cruise for everyone else onboard.  
 

Most of us know of CV-19 cases in families where there was a wide range of who contracted CV-19, from only one member to all members.  The reason why some were able to avoid it, despite being in close contact with the infected, seems to be the great unknown. 
 

It’s only a matter of time, if it hasn’t already happened, where someone vaccinated has a breakthrough case and someone else (unvaccinated) sharing the same common space doesn’t contract CV-19.  

[smokeybandit]

30 minutes ago, atgood said:

IMO It’s a false presumption to automatically assume that an unvaccinated person will be much more likely to contract CV-19, and therefore make a cruise unsafe and ruin a cruise for everyone else onboard.  
 

Most of us know of CV-19 cases in families where there was a wide range of who contracted CV-19, from only one member to all members.  The reason why some were able to avoid it, despite being in close contact with the infected, seems to be the great unknown. 
 

It’s only a matter of time, if it hasn’t already happened, where someone vaccinated has a breakthrough case and someone else (unvaccinated) sharing the same common space doesn’t contract CV-19.  

 

I haven't heard of one single case of someone getting covid from a vaccinated person.

[BOOKBOOKBOOK]

47 minutes ago, atgood said:

IMO It’s a false presumption to automatically assume that an unvaccinated person will be much more likely to contract CV-19, and therefore make a cruise unsafe and ruin a cruise for everyone else onboard.  
 

Most of us know of CV-19 cases in families where there was a wide range of who contracted CV-19, from only one member to all members.  The reason why some were able to avoid it, despite being in close contact with the infected, seems to be the great unknown. 
 

It’s only a matter of time, if it hasn’t already happened, where someone vaccinated has a breakthrough case and someone else (unvaccinated) sharing the same common space doesn’t contract CV-19.  

 

It's not a false presumption when the science points to the complete opposite. If enough unvaccinated passengers were to contract COVID-19 on a cruise, the cruise experience is ruined for everyone if port authorities turn ships away knowing that cases are onboard. This is not including the possibility of eating take-out food from your cabins should enough cases surface.

 

The Science

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/fully-vaccinated-people.html - "Preliminary data from Israel suggest that people vaccinated with the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine who develop COVID-19 have a four-fold lower viral load than unvaccinated people."

 

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2104849 - Fully vaccinated nursing home residents are over four times less likely of contracting COVID-19 than unvaccinated residents.

 

Breakthrough cases have already happened for vaccinated people, but they are at extremely low rates with near zero rates of hospitalization. A handful of breakthrough cases does not invalidate the vaccine's effectiveness. Just because an extremely small percentage of people with six fingers exist doesn't mean we're revising hand diagrams in biology textbooks.

Edited May 20, 2021 by BOOKBOOKBOOK

[jean87510]

On 5/18/2021 at 3:57 PM, tserface said:

 We get vaccines for shingles, flu, and tetanus/etc.  Also whooping cough is mixed in with one of them.

 

 

Tom

Tdap (diphtheria, tetanus and pertussis *whooping cough*) is not a yearly vaccine.  I believe shingles vaccine is 2 doses 6 months apart? 

[xpcdoojk]

On 5/19/2021 at 9:08 AM, smokeybandit said:

I've flown several times and the only extra process was to declare that you weren't sick or around someone sick.

Yep

[atgood]

39 minutes ago, smokeybandit said:

 

I haven't heard of one single case of someone getting covid from a vaccinated person.

My apologies for any confusion, but I wasn’t meaning for the unvaccinated person to catch it in a breakthrough case.  
 

Rather, I meant where both the vaccinated person and unvaccinated person have the same exposure to some one else and the unvaccinated person person doesn’t get CV-19, but the vaccinated person does.