NCL should let us cancel cruises with no penalties due to the new variant

[CarolinaMamma]

Remember, it took about 5 months for Delta to get bad in the US after it was first discovered/ Who knows what will happen with Omicron, but I still think my January cruise is going to be safer than eating out in a local restaurant where no vaccine or testing is required/ 

[Diver2014]

13 minutes ago, CarolinaMamma said:

Remember, it took about 5 months for Delta to get bad in the US after it was first discovered/ Who knows what will happen with Omicron, but I still think my January cruise is going to be safer than eating out in a local restaurant where no vaccine or testing is required/ 

My opinion exactly. Might as well get used to the 'variants' because they aren't going away any time soon.  Best to just get on with your life and do what is best for you.  The rest of us will go cruising.

[BermudaBound2014]

9 hours ago, craig01020 said:

If you're on a fully vaccinated ship with passengers who were recently tested, then that's safer than staying home and going to the grocery store.

 

You can't expect a business (yes, NCL is a business) to keep offering refunds to anyone who gets cold feet.

 

Traveling during a pandemic always carries some level of risk, but a Norwegian cruise is as safe as you can make it.

 

If you don't want to lose any money, keep it in the bank.

 

Not sure it's safer than the grocery store. In the grocery store you don't spend more than 15 minutes sitting next to someone. Mind you, I'm not afraid of covid, but if cruise ships were so much "safer: there wouldn't be so many cases found onboard. PS: I still attend UofM games mask-less, so I am a rebel. 

 

I do agree that NCL can not keep offering refunds. At this point anyone choosing to cruise knows the risks. Insurance companies are a good investment right now.

 

PS; with 6% inflation you are losing money keeping it in the bank :).

Edited November 29, 2021 by BermudaBound2014

[BermudaBound2014]

5 hours ago, CruizinKittie40 said:

I know this isn't directed at me but I don't think they should cancel all cruises, I just think I should be given the option of a refund.  

 

I actually do the above, I work from home, binge Hulu and do most of my shopping online 🙂

 

I do not mean to be disrespectful so please don't take it that way. It seems you are highly covid conscious and have a low risk tolerance, in which case, you should not plan any travel. I mean that sincerely. The covid situation is still far too fluid and does involves risk.  NCL is 12.3 Billion dollars in debt and still hemorrhaging cash. They no longer have the luxury of offering a refund to you.

 

 

Edited November 29, 2021 by BermudaBound2014

[CruisinMaterial]

As many have pointed out, NCL is not doing well financially. If they have to restructure their debt into 2027, that should send clear bells and whistles about this company's financial health. If this whole new variant goes south, I don't see NCLH making it out the other side of another shut down. That's being honest.

 

If you don't wish to travel then you should have bought cancel for any reason insurance with a COVID rider. This is not the cruise line's rubbish travel insurance but ones being sold from third-party companies who insure travel stuff. They have those policies out there. Yes, they're pricey but if you're unable to decide if it's safe to travel or not during this on-going, never-ending pandemic, then this is what you should be using. I've bought it for both my previous and upcoming voyages. I will be going unless the cruise lines stop sailing.

 

Our COVID numbers with Delta variant are growing rapidly with more days over 2% positivity rate which they were using previously for instituting COVID precautions. Now it seems to be more relaxed. We'll see how far gone it gets before anyone does something about it. In the interim, mask up, washy washy and be happy, happy! 😎

[craig01020]

1 hour ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

Not sure it's safer than the grocery store. In the grocery store you don't spend more than 15 minutes sitting next to someone. Mind you, I'm not afraid of covid, but if cruise ships were so much "safer: there wouldn't be so many cases found onboard.

There are only "so many" cases on cruise ships because of testing. No one is tested at the grocery store (or football game), so we don't know who has it and who doesn't.

 

Number of cases isn't the real issue. It's severe symptoms, which vaccinated people are much less likely to get.

 

Can we just go back to talking about chair hogs or gratuities?

[raitch]

9 minutes ago, craig01020 said:

Can we just go back to talking about chair hogs or gratuities?

Remember when we all were worried about Norvirus outbreaks onboard?  Good times.  

[Laszlo]

21 minutes ago, raitch said:

Remember when we all were worried about Norvirus outbreaks onboard?  Good times.  

The good old days.......   

 

[BermudaBound2014]

32 minutes ago, craig01020 said:

Can we just go back to talking about chair hogs or gratuities?

I think I can oblige- there is a thread talking about cabin stewards not turning down the cabin twice a day that was dangerously flirting with becoming a tipping topic 🙂 🙂

 

and yes- I do agree that testing is part of the problem. 

[coffeebean]

19 hours ago, SpainAlien said:

I don't agree that Norwegian are making it as safe as they could after all they have no masks required and no social distancing

But....everyone on board is vaccinated and tested at the pier. That is good enough for me.

 

I'm just off a Royal ship (Serenade) where there were un-vaccinated people on board and non compliance of the Covid protocols. There were people walking around inside the ship and getting on elevators with no masks on. I know I will feel safer on our upcoming NCL cruise on Joy.

[coffeebean]

19 hours ago, KAYKAY121 said:

You can wear a mask if you wish. Nobody is stopping you from doing so.  If you have anxiety over sickness, it should not warrant the mandate to other passengers who are comfortable without a mask to wear one so you feel safer. 

I'll go one step further and build on what you said. Anyone who wants to feel safer and do everything they can to protect themselves, should wear an N95 mask or equivalent. Cloth or those blue disposable surgical masks do not offer the protection that an N95 mask does.

[FLcruisergrl]

10 hours ago, raitch said:

Remember when we all were worried about Norvirus outbreaks onboard?  Good times.  

I’ve had both COVID and Noro. Wayyyy more worried about Noro.

[SpainAlien]

4 hours ago, coffeebean said:

But....everyone on board is vaccinated and tested at the pier. That is good enough for me.

 

I'm just off a Royal ship (Serenade) where there were un-vaccinated people on board and non compliance of the Covid protocols. There were people walking around inside the ship and getting on elevators with no masks on. I know I will feel safer on our upcoming NCL cruise on Joy.

I agree, I'm on Carnival Sunrise and it's the same

 

[bstel]

18 hours ago, CruiseMH said:

If you wear a KN95 or FFP2 mask you are protecting yourself, but not others.

If you wear a "normal" medical mask you are protecting others but not yourself.

 

I hope this is a typo on your part.  if you are wearing a N95 or equivalent you are definitely also protecting others.

[20165]

No snide remark here, but i dont agree with the original post that NCL should allow people to cancel without penalty after the final payment.  We are going to be dealing with different variants for a while and i would expect any cruise line to change their policies every time unless its govt mandated. 

Now i will say, in my opinion NCL has done the most to try to ensure a safe, virus free cruise with requiring vaccinations and testing before boarding.  We are pretty avid RCL cruisers and we wont be back on those ships until the do the same.  It goes a long way for us knowing that anyone we talk to on board is vaxed vs. playing the guessing game on other lines.  All my opinion so go easy on me...

 

[ColeThornton]

37 minutes ago, jumbojem96 said:

It’s okay to express concern about the virus.

 

It's absolutely fine.  Just temper one's concerns with some common sense and personal responsibility.

[BermudaBound2014]

5 minutes ago, ColeThornton said:

 

It's absolutely fine.  Just temper one's concerns with some common sense and personal responsibility.

 

This post wins the internet today.

 

Of course it's fine to express some concern over the virus, but unless you have a comorbidity it defies logic to continue to live in such fear. If you have a comorbidity wear an N95 mask or stay home because the vaccine doesn't protect you. 

 

While we are at it, NCL doesn't protect you either. Sure their policy is 100% vaccinated but you are kidding yourself if you believe covid isn't onboard (or that everyone onboard is vaccinated). If you have a comorbidity (or are truly still fearful), take personal responsibility and wear a N95 mask at all times. It's that simple. Only you can protect yourself. 

 

The only thing I'm afraid of on a cruise ship is being quarantined because I sat next to the wrong person in the comedy club.

 

And noro. Noro scares me :).

 

 

[PTC DAWG]

On 11/29/2021 at 9:11 AM, susanf31 said:

 

 

Enough. If you are still fearful, please stay home, wear your mask, take as many jabs as the billion dollar pharmaceutical companies tell you to.  Stop asking corporations to give you money back because you are afraid of a variant that you KNEW would come. Stop booking trips in the middle of a pandemic if you aren't willing to accept the risks of traveling during a pandemic.  We all KNOW viruses mutate.  We have to live WITH Covid-19. It's not ever going away.  So book your travel and have fun, but please stay home if you are expecting companies or fellow passengers to cowtow to your fear.

Well said.  

[Navis]

At this point in the pandemic, I tend to agree that risk associated with variants is a known risk that should have been considered at the time of the booking. That said, I do sympathize with the OP as a variant like Omicron could significantly alter the likelihood of cruise enjoyment and risk of interruption.

 

People keep talking about risk of infection, severity of symptoms and current masking policies as if that is all that needs to be taken into account, but the truth is far more complex and likely out of our individual control. The problem I see is travel protocols that have been focused on one thing and one thing only … transmissibility and NOT severity (probably because until now, severity has remained a constant in this equation). With a variant like this one …. Much more transmissible, but less severe … the probability that my cruise gets  “interrupted” in one form or another goes up materially regardless of my vaccination status or whether I or anyone in my travel party contract the virus or not.

 

As the facts come to light, it is likely to be a mixed bag (as has been the case with these variants from the start). Scientists yesterday and today have already started saying that vaccines will struggle with Omicron to prevent breakthrough infections, but they suspect that vaccines will hold up well against the risk of severe infection. However, they also suspect (again, not proven yet) that natural immunity derived from prior infection will be almost non-existent with Omicron so that’s a large population that becomes at risk again.

 

Again, trying to look on the bright side, it does appear this variant causes less severe illness (which is, of course, great for those of us with elderly family we have been trying to protect throughout this pandemic), but what does that matter when all the protocols in place for travel are based only on transmissibility? If those protocols don’t change (and not sure how they could given testing would not identify the strain one is infected with) I think the likelihood that I end up in quarantine either because I myself as a fully vaccinated passenger test positive or as a close contact of someone on the ship that tests positive goes up. 

I also worry about home port and destination-specific cruise protocols/requirements, which again, are based 100% on transmissibility and are subject to revision almost daily. Does my risk of being forced to quarantine on ship for a period of time increase? Yes. Does my risk of being required to disembark at the next port to make my way home increase? Yes. Does the likelihood that the cruise ship itself crosses its maximum permitted positive test rate threshold mandating immediate cruise cancellation increase? Yes. Does the risk that I have to quarantine for a period of time in a foreign country before permitted to fly home increase? Yes.

 

Again, to the OP’s comment, I do think this was a risk assumed at booking … well, at least I can say it was for us. We are scheduled to cruise out of Barbados in March (after having to cancel and rebook 3 times the past 2 years) and we still plan to go (partly because our significant cruise credit it about to expire), but understand that the risk our cruise will be interrupted in one way or another likely went up significantly in the last week.

 

[susanf31]

47 minutes ago, 20165 said:

It goes a long way for us knowing that anyone we talk to on board is vaxed vs. playing the guessing game on other lines.  All my opinion so go easy on me...

This has me very concerned that people are believing that everyone onboard will be vaxxed. There is a huge market out there for fake Vaxx cards. There is no way of verifying if vaxx cards are real.  My 7 year old could make a fake vaxx card using OfficeMax card stock and it would look exactly like my "real" one from Walgreen pharm.

 

Are there people out there who really believe that "anyone we talk to on board is vaxxed"?  There will be many people onboard each ship who are not fully vaxxed and if that's a game-changer for you, you might consider not cruising.

 

[PTC DAWG]

15 minutes ago, susanf31 said:

This has me very concerned that people are believing that everyone onboard will be vaxxed. There is a huge market out there for fake Vaxx cards. There is no way of verifying if vaxx cards are real.  My 7 year old could make a fake vaxx card using OfficeMax card stock and it would look exactly like my "real" one from Walgreen pharm.

 

Are there people out there who really believe that "anyone we talk to on board is vaxxed"?  There will be many people onboard each ship who are not fully vaxxed and if that's a game-changer for you, you might consider not cruising.

 

I talk with people all the time in my area, I never wonder if they are vaccinated or not.  

 

But yeah, someone who wants to cheat the system, they probably can...karma is a *****, she rhymes with witch.  

Edited November 30, 2021 by PTC DAWG

[DenGNNJ]

22 hours ago, The Traveling Man said:

I'm sorry, but I don't speak the Emoticon language.  What does this mean?

The raising hands emoji depicts two raised hands, palms up, with lines above them, implying motion. It's used in a celebratory way, to express joy, pride, or surprise (the good kind).

[BermudaBound2014]

59 minutes ago, susanf31 said:

Are there people out there who really believe that "anyone we talk to on board is vaxxed"?  

 

 

Unfortunately yes, people naively believe this.

 

I hope that anyone with comorbidities has enough common sense to wear a N95 mask at all times onboard NCL ships because the vaccine doesn't protect you from catching the virus.

 

Currently 30% of the people hospitalized at University of Michigan are vaccinated (and that percentage is on the rise).  Of those 30% who are both vaccinated and hospitalized, 89% have comorbidities!!

 

Moral of the story, those vaccinated without any comorbidity have an extremely small chance of needing to be hospitalized if you contract covid.  Those with comorbidities should protect themselves.

 

Edited November 30, 2021 by BermudaBound2014

[The Traveling Man]

18 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

 I still attend UofM games mask-less, so I am a rebel. 

 

 

I thought the mascot of the U of M was the Wolverine.  Oh, maybe you meant the University of Miami.  No, wait, they're the Hurricanes and their mascot is Sebastian the Ibis.  So I guess you attend the football games at the University of Mississippi, Ole Miss.  Colonel Reb was the official mascot of Ole Miss Rebels, the collegiate athletic teams of the University of Mississippi ("Ole Miss") in Oxford, Mississippi. Designed in 1936,^[1] the Colonel served as the teams' official sideline mascot from 1979 until 2003. The university replaced him in 2010 with a new on-field mascot, the Black Bear.  (Thank you, Wikipedia)

[sanger727]

No idea how you could have made final payment on a December cruise without being aware that new covid variants keep popping up and the current strain could change at any time. This isn’t a NCL problem. This is more of the people who have stuck their heads in the sand for the last two years… ‘NCL says they will sail in august’, ‘ no, really, my pvp knows everything and we will be sailing in September’, ‘the vaccine rules expire in December’, etc