What if we do not want Medallion Class on PCL ?

[Potstech]

6 hours ago, voljeep said:

per who ?

Knowledgeable people.

[Dunk]

As far as "tracking" you, companies like Princess, our your grocery store rewards card and the like, really don't care about you, John Q. Public, as an individual. They don't care what you individually buy or where you go. They DO care about trends--things like "only 10% of passengers used the spa", "22% stayed on board in XYZ port", "passengers 65 and older spent the most per capita on chocolate in the gift shop", things like that. That's how they refine their offerings, and determine how they can increase revenue. 

[Daniel A]

2 hours ago, Dunk said:

As far as "tracking" you, companies like Princess, our your grocery store rewards card and the like, really don't care about you, John Q. Public, as an individual. They don't care what you individually buy or where you go. They DO care about trends--things like "only 10% of passengers used the spa", "22% stayed on board in XYZ port", "passengers 65 and older spent the most per capita on chocolate in the gift shop", things like that. That's how they refine their offerings, and determine how they can increase revenue. 

I tend to agree with you in concept, but this technology will permit contact tracing in the event of an outbreak of any disease onboard.

[mevs904]

Good point about contact tracing.  In the event of a Covid case you could be informed  if the person that you were sitting next to at Crooners or in the theatre was infected.

I just thought about one more feature of the Medallion that we like.  Your cabin steward can tell whether you are in or not.  On our Medallion cruises we have never been bothered by the steward knocking on the door to see if he or she could come in and clean.

[caribill]

21 hours ago, Geoffa30 said:

Cannot believe we are still getting posts like this about being tracked on the ship. What on earth are people doing on a cruise that they’re so concerned about being tracked?

 

Peopl;e concerned about being tracked should not use cell phone on land. Serious tracking is involved when your cell phone is turned on.

[caribill]

16 hours ago, bobndee said:

I'm new to Princess - my first cruise with them is booked for March 2022. I've been curious about Medallion Class since I first heard about it. So I watched some videos on the Princess site about it. One thing that I picked up is that you can use it in the shops for purchases and in the casino for wagering. That kinda scares me. If someone were to lose their medallion then the finder could go on a shopping and/or gambling spree and their spending would go directly to the owner's account.

 

If you lose your Medallion and report it, they can immediately locate it.

 

When making a purchase , your photo should appear on the cashier's screen. In most cases it should be obvious that the user of a lost card is not the owner.

[caribill]

8 hours ago, Dunk said:

As far as "tracking" you, .... your grocery store rewards card and the like, really don't care about you, John Q. Public, as an individual. They don't care what you individually buy or where you go.

 

Yes they do care. That is why:

a) You can receive special offers about things you usually purchase.

b) Receive a recall notice if a product you purchased has been recalled.

[ontheweb]

4 hours ago, mevs904 said:

Good point about contact tracing.  In the event of a Covid case you could be informed  if the person that you were sitting next to at Crooners or in the theatre was infected.

I just thought about one more feature of the Medallion that we like.  Your cabin steward can tell whether you are in or not.  On our Medallion cruises we have never been bothered by the steward knocking on the door to see if he or she could come in and clean.

But our cabin steward will think we are always in the cabin hiding in the safe.🤣

 

OK, this time I did put an emoji with my post.😉 And now another one.

[Tolkmit]

18 hours ago, Daniel A said:

There are things called faraday cages or faraday bags that will block radio transmissions.  I bought two faraday pouches to hold my medallions so I could block being tracked if I wanted that option.  You could always pick up a faraday container and put the medallions in them before you put them into the safe if you would be that concerned.

 

Here is what I got from Amazon:  Amazon.com: Todoxi Faraday Key Fob Protector (2 Pack) Faraday Bags Car Key Signal Blocking, Car Security Protection Pouch: Car Electronics

 

 

 

These are questionable for accomplishing what you are hoping they will. To be an actual Faraday cage, something has to be grounded; there is no mobile container that can work as an actual Faraday cage. This sort of thing can block certain frequencies that might be used to read your RFID. However, since we have no idea whatsoever which frequencies cruise lines are using, and these specific bags won't say what frequencies they block, it is a guess as to whether they will provide any additional privacy on a cruise ship. Given that cruise lines are going to use the frequencies they are least likely to get interference on, but also that won't cost them an arm and a leg; I'd give these a 3 out of 4 chance at being effective at blocking medallion signal. Not bad for the price, but also important to be aware they may not be doing anything for you in this situation.

 

If cruise lines really want to track you on board though, they will; with increasing amounts of ease. They can put an RFID into whatever form of room key they give you, and use multiple frequency scanners to read it regardless of what container it's in. There is also ever improving AI, which can be given access to the cameras and RFID tracking data; which can form a relatively accurate track of each person without an RFID tracker by ignoring the people it has RFID tracking data on. I know it sounds like science fiction to some, but it exists. The only question is when it becomes cheap enough that cruise lines choose to install it; and that point may have already been reached since most of the cost, RFID on most people and extensive camera coverage, has already been covered.

 

Anyone who has a major problem being tracked while on board, I'd very much recommend just not cruising. You certainly aren't doing anything to limit being tracked by using a card instead of a medallion, those have RFID as well.

[Daniel A]

15 minutes ago, Tolkmit said:

 

These are questionable for accomplishing what you are hoping they will. To be an actual Faraday cage, something has to be grounded; there is no mobile container that can work as an actual Faraday cage.

 

They can put an RFID into whatever form of room key they give you, and use multiple frequency scanners to read it regardless of what container it's in.

7 hours ago, caribill said:

 

Peopl;e concerned about being tracked should not use cell phone on land. Serious tracking is involved when your cell phone is turned on.

A couple of quick responses: 

 

"Small faraday cages with no conductors penetrating the shield do NOT need to be grounded."  Grounding for Electromagnetic Pulse Protection - Futurescience.com - EMP

 

The medallion needs to have a battery to generate the necessary signal strength to reach the Medallion receivers.  The key cards are too thin to accept the size of battery needed to work with Medallion Class and I don't see Princess investing the money in technology that would accomplish tracking key cards. 

 

Turning off your cell phone doesn't block the ability to track it.  The only sure way to ensure your cell phone isn't being tracked is to remove the battery or keep it in a Faraday cage.  Better yet, take the battery out and put the phone in the Faraday cage.

 

These aren't concepts I read on the internet, these were concepts I had to know for my employment.  Faraday bags work.

[JF - retired RRT]

8 hours ago, mevs904 said:

Good point about contact tracing.  In the event of a Covid case you could be informed  if the person that you were sitting next to at Crooners or in the theatre was infected.

I just thought about one more feature of the Medallion that we like.  Your cabin steward can tell whether you are in or not.  On our Medallion cruises we have never been bothered by the steward knocking on the door to see if he or she could come in and clean.

I was getting dressed on a non-medallion cruise and the steward knocked on the door and immediately opened the door. Didn't give me time to respond in any way and there I stood in all my glory.🤢😱

[Iamcruzin]

7 hours ago, caribill said:

 

Peopl;e concerned about being tracked should not use cell phone on land. Serious tracking is involved when your cell phone is turned on.

How many cameras are around in stores parking lost and on highways?
since we installed a ring doorbell nobody can walk past my house without me knowing about it.  Last year the police came to my house because we have the ring to investigate a murder on the next block. They asked for access which we provided. Nothing showed up on my device but the neighbor across the street from the victim had all the information on their recording.  It was the husband. My son went to school with the poor victim.

The point is we are always under surveillance whether  we know it or not.

 

[caribill]

56 minutes ago, Iamcruzin said:

How many cameras are around in stores parking lost and on highways?
since we installed a ring doorbell nobody can walk past my house without me knowing about it. .

The point is we are always under surveillance whether  we know it or not.

 

 

The UK has this down to as science. Between cameras and facial recognition, they can zoom in on people several blocks away and identify them. For some past terrorist attacks, they were able to work backwards and trace the perpetrator backwards from the scene to his house cities away.

[Iamcruzin]

Just now, caribill said:

 

The UK has this down to as science. Between cameras and facial recognition, they can zoom in on people several blocks away and identify them. For some past terrorist attacks, they were able to work backwards and trace the perpetrator backwards from the scene to his house cities away.

And to think people are afraid to order a drink via the medallion. Royal Caribbean has the wow band with an onboard cost of $5. It was very convenient  especially for my wife who doesn't always have pockets for the card. No need for a lanyard around your neck.

[lx200gps]

On 12/5/2020 at 10:59 AM, bobndee said:

I'm new to Princess - my first cruise with them is booked for March 2022. I've been curious about Medallion Class since I first heard about it. So I watched some videos on the Princess site about it. One thing that I picked up is that you can use it in the shops for purchases and in the casino for wagering. That kinda scares me. If someone were to lose their medallion then the finder could go on a shopping and/or gambling spree and their spending would go directly to the owner's account.

There's another aspect to that as well.  As at the last time we sailed with a Medallion,  November 2019, if you did lose your Medallion (and didn't notice it right away) in theory the person finding it could go to one of the many screens, use the disk to find your name and cabin number (with helpful directions to get there), go to your cabin, open door and do whatever they wanted. AFAIR, this wasn't nearly as easy with the old style cruise cards, as there was no way to easily identify the cabin number, only the person's name appeared on the card.  Sure, this is highly unlikely to happen, but it is a security hole, and I'm not too sure Princess takes it seriously. Maybe with the long downtime, they have patched the hole, but I'm not holding my breath.

[cruzsnooze]

I bought a 10 pack of RFID blocking credit card sleeves. I put the medallion in one and went to the screens to see if it was blocked, IT WAS BLOCKED. The medallion also didn't unlock my cabin door when in the sleeve.  I then put the medallion in my room safe for the duration of the cruise. I did the same test with my regular old black cruise card and it also was not able to be read when in a 10 cent RFID sleeve. 

 I keep all my credit cards in a sleeve in my wallet since one time someone read my Visa card without my knowledge and charged up a bunch. 

[Roger88]

3 hours ago, Iamcruzin said:

And to think people are afraid to order a drink via the medallion. Royal Caribbean has the wow band with an onboard cost of $5. It was very convenient  especially for my wife who doesn't always have pockets for the card. No need for a lanyard around your neck.

It sounds very comfortable to use. I also remember this one time we were given bracelets where we could put or money instead of caring cash or phones with us. It was very comfortable to use and we could even swim with it. 

[caribill]

12 hours ago, lx200gps said:

There's another aspect to that as well.  As at the last time we sailed with a Medallion,  November 2019, if you did lose your Medallion (and didn't notice it right away) in theory the person finding it could go to one of the many screens, use the disk to find your name and cabin number (with helpful directions to get there), go to your cabin, open door and do whatever they wanted. AFAIR, this wasn't nearly as easy with the old style cruise cards, as there was no way to easily identify the cabin number, only the person's name appeared on the card.  Sure, this is highly unlikely to happen, but it is a security hole, and I'm not too sure Princess takes it seriously. Maybe with the long downtime, they have patched the hole, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

On all but one Princess ship it is easy to obtain a person's cabin number if you know the person's name.

[AF-1]

Most likely during this downtown; Princess and other cruise lines have been developing software or buying software that will make the medallion experience more efficient and added health info to include if you have gotten the new vaccine.  This is just my guess

[Ombud]

For those who don't want to sail with medallion because they're concerned that they may be monitored,  what kind of vacation are you going to go on in the future? Around a decade ago I was upset with the boys because they were supposed to be back in the cabin by 11 and it was closing in on 12. I called the front desk and they put me in touch with security. Security told me go to my TV and the screen showed my boys. Playing cards in a hallway. With a bunch of other kids. So if you think that you were not being monitored on your last cruise /  that monitoring will increase, they've always added (fortunately)

 

The best thing with the Medallion is that I just have to go to the app to find them (although they're young adults / not kids now)

Edited December 7, 2020 by Ombud

[Essiesmom]

I can think of at least two instances when a medallion locator would have been helpful.  Watching for pier runners?  All those announcements asking for so and so to contact the front desk when waiting to leave port...  One time I was on a Celebrity ship, doing a B2B.  Turnaround was in San Juan.  There were over 100 people doing the B2B.  We waited in Michael's Club for the last person to show up, but finally let us off into the hot terminal where we stood around for over an hour, no seating...  They finally passed out water.  They were still looking for the last person.  And no new passengers could board.  Finally they let us back on, and had taped up the cabin door of the missing guest, as for all they knew, she might have gone overboard.  Well, one of my dinner partners was at the front dest when she arrived asking why her cabin door was taped over...  A lot of angst and inconvenience could have been avoided if medallion tech. had been in use.  EM

[AF-1]

ombud;  that is a good story;  thanks for sharing

[JF - retired RRT]

For those who don't want to use a medallion...I had a thought.

Book only Pacific Princess (at least as long as she stays in the fleet). No medallions and no plans for them.😉

[Ride-The-Waves]

On 12/5/2020 at 1:25 PM, cruzsnooze said:

If you read my post #18 you'd have read that regular cards will ALWAYS be available.

Not accurate.  PCL has stated that will no longer issue RFID cards and everyone must carry the medallion for "contactless" purposes.

[ontheweb]

2 hours ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

Not accurate.  PCL has stated that will no longer issue RFID cards and everyone must carry the medallion for "contactless" purposes.

Now I have been advised to lock my medallion in the safe, but you say we will not get cards. So, how are we supposed to go anywhere or do anything?😢