The Debbie Downers have been right all along

[rkacruiser]

7 hours ago, Hlitner said:

Suffice it to say that a positive COVID test (regardless of whether there are any symptoms) will mean a significant delay outside the country at your own expense.  

 

3 hours ago, KirkNC said:

I think this is one of many things early adopters are not considering.

 

Yet:  bookings continue to be made.  

 

Caveat emptor seems to be a "term/concept" that many fail to consider.  

 

 

[Mary229]

1 hour ago, rkacruiser said:

 

Yet:  bookings continue to be made.  

 

Caveat emptor seems to be a "term/concept" that many fail to consider.  

First in the spirit of disclosure, I only book one cruise at a time.  I book the next one while onboard.   So I am still operating on that single deposit.  
 

In defense of those who are booking they are using their risk reward equation.   Some of us believe the first two quarters of 2022 present an opportunity to get on a lightly traveled cruise to visit open destinations that  are still not filled to capacity.   Secondly I think many people are predicting that 2022 will fill for closer locations like the Caribbean and Alaska and they simply don’t want to go another year without cruising.  Then there are some who plain and simple are getting older and don’t see wasting anymore time not traveling as at our ages every year presents more and more aging. 

[tosteve1]

Time waits for no one...I don’t blame people for booking at all.

[KroozNut]

12 minutes ago, tosteve1 said:

Time waits for no one...I don’t blame people for booking at all.

 

A good strategy for those that (for some reason) enjoy riding the continuous cancellation/refund/FCC merry-go-round.

[Mary229]

3 minutes ago, KroozNut said:

 

A good strategy for those that (for some reason) enjoy riding the continuous cancellation/refund/FCC merry-go-round.

It just doesn't bother everyone.  If they cancel I have whole page of favorited cruises lined up to take its place.  It just doesn't bother me one iota. 

[HappyInVan]

On 3/19/2021 at 2:16 AM, KirkNC said:

Here is an interesting take on why Australia has been so successful.  They currently have less then 20 cases in the whole country.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/03/15/10-reasons-australias-covid-19-success-story/

 

 

 

Listen to Debbie, and you won't go-around and around. 🙄

 

Back on topic. Australia is a good case study. Why have they been so successful?

 

Yes, they are in an isolated part of the world. However, their early success stems from their history of quarantining themselves from imported fauna and flora.

 

At the beginning, they CHOSE to use the quarantine model. Culturally accepted by the locals. Simple to implement. Close the border, and use quarantine hotels for returning residents. Restricting the returnees to a controlled trickle.

 

They didn't assume that people would do the right thing. Their protocols would ensure that the right things would be done.

 

They stopped trying to flatten the curve, after the first wave. Instead, imposed shutdowns until covid was down to near zero. Life back to near-normal many months ago.

 

Their governments didn't suffer from ideological or mental confusion. They are focused and tough, willing to do unpopular things. Kudos to the Aussies and Kiwi.

 

In fact, I would be quite happy if Canada did a 3-week national lockdown in September. By then, 75% of the adult population would be vax. The lockdown would be to clean up what's left in circulation.

 

Then, its back to Merry Xmas and Happy New Year. Live the dream! 👍

 

[fatcat04]

4 hours ago, Mary229 said:

It just doesn't bother everyone.  If they cancel I have whole page of favorited cruises lined up to take its place.  It just doesn't bother me one iota. 

Us either. We've had 3 cancelled and have 2 booked. FCC booking expires 12/21, use by 12/22 so might as well plan ahead to get the cabins we want and take advantage of good promos. Both the cancellations after our initial March 2020 cancellation (which took 4 months but that was understandable) have been processed fine. 

[kazu]

1 hour ago, fatcat04 said:

Us either. We've had 3 cancelled and have 2 booked. FCC booking expires 12/21, use by 12/22 so might as well plan ahead to get the cabins we want and take advantage of good promos. Both the cancellations after our initial March 2020 cancellation (which took 4 months but that was understandable) have been processed fine. 

 

Just in case it is of help if things develop unfavourably (heaven forbid) or if itineraries in 2022 don’t “call to you”..... I had a chat with HAL and was told if I called the guest reservations number (the 1-800 # we all know, I believe) that my FCC could be extended.

I have no need to do it, yet but just sharing in case it helps.

[kazu]

5 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

In fact, I would be quite happy if Canada did a 3-week national lockdown in September.

 

Speak for yourself.  Why should those that have been careful suffer again?

I am sick and tired of pandering to those who didn’t play ball and we pay the price.  We are paying the price in vaccines (slow to get).  Montreal is doing 60 year olds and we are at 85+ year olds.

 

I see no reason why provinces that have played ball should have to go into lockdown.

 

If there had been a National plan in the first place that would have been great - there wasn’t - we are doing our best here in Atlantic Canada and have no need of a lockdown in our province IMO.  Nor in the about to be rejuvenated Atlantic Bubble.  Sheesh.

We were happy to play ball but on this I call foul ball.

 

5 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

 

By then, 75% of the adult population would be vax.

 

I doubt they will be here.  As usual the Maritimers are last.

And a tad fed up - speaking for myself only.  

[iancal]

We are at 64 plus.  But...the number will to some degree depend on demographics.

 

[Mary229]

3 minutes ago, kazu said:

 

Sorry I don’t know what STEM is?

Science Technology Engineering Mathematics in education 

[kazu]

2 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

Science Technology Engineering Mathematics in education 

Thnx

[iancal]

Our challenge has been that political considerations have outweighed scientific and medical considerations, advice, and direction.

 

I find it unfathomable that when it comes to covid issues some people put more faith in the guidance and advice from politicians than they do from the scientific and medical communities.  I suspect that it is denial more than anything.

 

Not only that, even after one year since despite the deaths, the hospitalizations, the post covid  symptoms that there are still people in this group who believe elected reps over those with knowledge.  We are still having weekly anti covid rallies in our community led by far right faith leaders.  Very strange.  

Edited March 22, 2021 by iancal

[seaoma]

9 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

They didn't assume that people would do the right thing. Their protocols would ensure that the right things would be done.

 

They also subsidized wages in Australia. I found an article that stated they alleviated the financial impact of the economic woes for 6 million Australians to the tune of $928 every 2 weeks. Initially they stated this would last for 6 months, but it was expanded to include more employees in July of 2020. I'm sure that also had a significant impact on the people's willingness to do the right thing.

 

My husband, an Australian by birth, says Aussies would be happy to stay home under those circumstances.😁

 

[idiebabe]

10 hours ago, Mary229 said:

It just doesn't bother everyone.  If they cancel I have whole page of favorited cruises lined up to take its place.  It just doesn't bother me one iota. 

It doesn’t bother us either!  I have three Booked and looking to book another one. I have applied the FCC’s to two of the Cruises.  Agree with fatcat04 that we are able to select the Rooms we like and the one Cruise we Booked the cost of the Room went up over $4,000.  

[Mary229]

1 minute ago, idiebabe said:

It doesn’t bother us either!  I have three Booked and looking to book another one. I have applied the FCC’s to two of the Cruises.  Agree with fatcat04 that we are able to select the Rooms we like and the one Cruise we Booked the cost of the Room went up over $4,000.  

Mine went up.  As was discussed in other threads I think HAL is moving to a more inclusive model plus they will need to cover the costs of the new regulations.   I assume our ships next year will not sail at 100% capacity. 

[HappyInVan]

11 hours ago, kazu said:

 

Speak for yourself.  Why should those that have been careful suffer again?

 

 

Phew! You're absolutely right.

 

I do caution that the vaccines this year might not be quite the game changer we hoped for.

 

See post #133 where I explain why Israel has vaccinated 80% of its adults. But only 56% of its entire population.

 

https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2774089-the-debbie-downers-have-been-right-all-along/page/6/

 

 

The problem at this point is that the spreaders are younger people, not the seniors. So, expect community infection to continue until we reach high levels of vax.

 

BC Public Health has belatedly realized this. They've delaying the second dose till 4 months. Instead, using the vaccines for the hotspots. So, those monkeys in Whistler are going to be offered vaccine before the seniors in their 70s.

 

The second problem (going forward) is that there are very big claims being made about the vaccines. Many will get careless. Causing continual community spread. With enough community spread, the Atlantic bubble will pop.

 

Then, there's the vax-resistant variants preparing to take center-stage.

 

IMO, it would be wise if we did a national lockdown to squeeze out the last dregs of covid. Before the start of the new school year. No need for the Atlantic bubble.

 

Get covid down to the levels we saw during the summer. In BC, we had @30 cases/day. By a coincidence, that's the level that qualifies Canada for unrestricted entry to the EU!!!!

 

Of course, I could be wrong? My name's not Debbie!

 

[iancal]

It is not just young people where we live.  We have a number of faith leaders who are filling their large churches to capacity, not social distancing, no masks.  One Pastor has already been fined and jailed.  I believe this has much more to do with politics than it does with faith.

 

 

Likewise we have a few faith leaders who organize weekly protest marches....no mask, no social distancing.    Fortunately the vast majority of our faith leaders are either following the restrictions.  Many started to do so well in advance of any Government covid regulations.

 

Our numbers are not where they should be so our lockdown restrictions, due to be relaxed this week, have been extended on the advice of our public health authorities.

 

 

 

Edited March 23, 2021 by iancal

[KroozNut]

19 hours ago, kazu said:

 

Just in case it is of help if things develop unfavourably (heaven forbid) or if itineraries in 2022 don’t “call to you”..... I had a chat with HAL and was told if I called the guest reservations number (the 1-800 # we all know, I believe) that my FCC could be extended.

I have no need to do it, yet but just sharing in case it helps.

 

Yes, our FCC was extended for us to be able to use it for our current April '22 booking.

[Hlitner]

6 hours ago, KroozNut said:

 

Yes, our FCC was extended for us to be able to use it for our current April '22 booking.

We had a similar issue/question when our 2021 Asian cruise was cancelled.  We had used a large FCC from a cancelled 2020 Asian cruise for that 2021 booking and had some concern that we would lose the FCC because of the time issues.  We called HAL about booking a 2022 Asian cruise (which we did through a cruise agent because it was a much better deal then booking direct with HAL) and asked about the FCC and its expiration date.  The HAL rep told us that it would be "no problem" if we wanted the FCC time limit extended for any future cruise.   The HAL rep was very friendly and helpful.

 

Under normal times, folks like me who use various cruise agencies may have found that HAL and other cruise lines were not very helpful and would suggest "deal with your cruise/travel agent."  But these days the attitude seems to be different and the attitude of being helpful is being extended to everyone.   There have actually been a few posts about HAL willing to match the deals offered by some cruise agencies although that has never been our experience.

 

Hank

[rkacruiser]

7 hours ago, iancal said:

It is not just young people where we live.  We have a number of faith leaders who are filling their large churches to capacity, not social distancing, no masks.  One Pastor has already been fined and jailed.  I believe this has much more to do with politics than it does with faith.

 

 

Likewise we have a few faith leaders who organize weekly protest marches....no mask, no social distancing.    Fortunately the vast majority of our faith leaders are either following the restrictions.  Many started to do so well in advance of any Government covid regulations.

 

Our numbers are not where they should be so our lockdown restrictions, due to be relaxed this week, have been extended on the advice of our public health authorities.

 

 

 

 

One would think that an educated person would have enough common sense and respect for the scientists that are trying to guide us through this pandemic to follow their advice.

 

I remain somewhat "in shock" that my dentist--who is in his 60's--responded to me earlier this month when I asked what vaccine he had received by saying:  "I am not going to get the vaccine."  He listed three reasons with the most disturbing to me was "the vaccine will causes changes to our DNA".  There is no evidence of that.  And, when I told that to my cardiologist on Monday afternoon when we were talking about the vaccine, he shook his head in disapproval and said somethings negative about certain "news media" and persons.  

[StLouisCruisers]

24 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

One would think that an educated person would have enough common sense and respect for the scientists that are trying to guide us through this pandemic to follow their advice.

 

I remain somewhat "in shock" that my dentist--who is in his 60's--responded to me earlier this month when I asked what vaccine he had received by saying:  "I am not going to get the vaccine."  He listed three reasons with the most disturbing to me was "the vaccine will causes changes to our DNA".  There is no evidence of that.  And, when I told that to my cardiologist on Monday afternoon when we were talking about the vaccine, he shook his head in disapproval and said somethings negative about certain "news media" and persons.  

 

I don't know which news media you're talking about but it's not something I've heard on my news media.  It sounds more like a Facebook theory or something from Bill Gates.

[rkacruiser]

1 hour ago, StLouisCruisers said:

 

I don't know which news media you're talking about but it's not something I've heard on my news media.  It sounds more like a Facebook theory or something from Bill Gates.

 

No idea where my dentist got his information.  But, as I said, how could a scientifically trained person at the age that he is believe that his DNA would be altered by receiving the vaccine?  

[idiebabe]

2 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

 

No idea where my dentist got his information.  But, as I said, how could a scientifically trained person at the age that he is believe that his DNA would be altered by receiving the vaccine?  

Just because someone is educated doesn’t mean they have Common Sense.   What is that old expression “Book Smart....Common Sense Stupid”!  

 

“It is a thousand times better to have Common Sense without Education than to have Education without Common Sense” .....Robert Green Ingersoll
 

I’d find another Dentist!  
 

 

 

[KirkNC]

1 hour ago, idiebabe said:

Just because someone is educated doesn’t mean they have Common Sense.   What is that old expression “Book Smart....Common Sense Stupid”!  

 

“It is a thousand times better to have Common Sense without Education than to have Education without Common Sense” .....Robert Green Ingersoll
 

I’d find another Dentist!  
 

 

 

That was my thought as well.