Zaandam and Rotterdam Situation (merged topics starting March 22, 2020)

[capriccio]

7 minutes ago, npcl said:

Why doesn't HAL do the following:

 

1. Request permission to offload only those that need advanced medical care

2. Agree to obtain and test every passenger and crew (Abbott's 20 minute test using office level equipment is now available with production of 50,000 per day.  Since this a very visible crisis HAL could probably get some of those or even better some of the antibody blood tests).

3. Based upon the result of those blood tests. For those that are not positive.  The local could go home to self quarantine. For those from other countries HAL could either charter planes or get those countries to send planes for their residents.  It would require those countries to be will to accept the planes.  Those from elsewhere in the US might as well fly home if they test negative.  The airports and planes are basically empty so odd of infecting someone else is low even if they had a false negative.  Then follow the directions of whatever state they are traveling to (probably notify the local health department in their home location)

4. Those that are ill with mild or moderate symptoms would need to remain on the ship, after all they don't have to worry about getting infected, they already are.  That number should be low enough that they can be adequately cared for (figuring around 200 passengers and crew).  Unlike the diamond where thousands were having to be feed, the crew could take care of a much smaller number, by following safety guidelines, and with the medical staff.

5. If any turn into serious they would get removed to land when needed, though if the ship had or could get ventilators (I would expect that each ship would or should have 1) so they might actually get as good of care on the ship.

 

This would minimize land based resources/hospitals. Get most off the ships. Have HAL take direct action to help resolve the problem. 

 

It sounds like the CDC would concur based on their comments in the current meeting noted above by Nymich but it would put an enormous amount of on-going responsibility on HAL.  I wonder how they feel about that.

Edited March 31, 2020 by capriccio

[Copper10-8]

12 minutes ago, sansterre said:

Doing an ok job.  He couldn't remember when Zaandam began cruise - March 8th he thought.  

We all know it was March 9th.  But he is handling streams of repetitive questions from the many County Commissioners well.

 

 

He's got a lot of weight on his shoulders in that meeting today! Dealing with politicians! 😉

 

He's actually semi-correct with his March 8th answer. Zaanie's prior "around the horn" cruise concluded on March 6th in Buenos Aires. The "current" voyage official commenced on March 7 with an overnight in BA. She left on March 8th to go "across" to Montevideo, Uruguay where she arrived on March 9.

 

 

Zaandam	3/6/2020	Fri	BUENOS AIRES
Zaandam	3/7/2020	Sat	BUENOS AIRES
Zaandam	3/8/2020	Sun	Buenos Aires
Zaandam	3/9/2020	Mon	Montevideo
Zaandam	3/10/2020	Tue	At Sea (South Atlantic Ocean)
Zaandam	3/11/2020	Wed	At Sea
Zaandam	3/12/2020	Thu	Port Stanley
Zaandam	3/13/2020	Fri	Scenic cruising Strait of Magellan
Zaandam	3/14/2020	Sat	Punta Arenas
Zaandam	3/15/2020	Sun	Ushuaia
Zaandam	3/16/2020	Mon	Scenic cruising Cape Horn
Zaandam	3/17/2020	Tue	Scenic cruising Sarmiento Channel
Zaandam	3/18/2020	Wed	Scenic cruising Chilean Fjords
Zaandam	3/19/2020	Thu	Puerto Montt
Zaandam	3/20/2020	Fri	At Sea (South Pacific Ocean)
Zaandam	3/21/2020	Sat	SAN ANTONIO (SANTIAGO)

[MarLieb]

52 minutes ago, 1ANGELCAT said:

What about the ones that are RESIDENTS of Broward and Florida .!

 

Yes, of course.  They should be helped by their own state and counties.

[Nymich]

2 minutes ago, capriccio said:

 

It sounds like the CDC would concur based on their comments in the current meeting noted above by Nymich but it would put an enormous amount of on-going responsibility on HAL.  I wonder how they feel about that.

Except the CDC rep seemed to indicate she would put the priority on those that are well so we can get them home.

Perhaps this would be to get the majority off to focus and give more room and less confusion to attend to the ill.

[Copper10-8]

Rumba anyone?

 

https://twitter.com/i/broadcasts/1lPKqVZLONwGb

[LauraS]

Please limit discussion to the topic title.   No politics, no in-fighting, no nastiness. 

 

 

Posts will be removed.

[capriccio]

7 minutes ago, Nymich said:

Except the CDC rep seemed to indicate she would put the priority on those that are well so we can get them home.

Perhaps this would be to get the majority off to focus and give more room and less confusion to attend to the ill.

 

Thanks for sharing that.  It would seem to concur with npcl's recommended steps 2 and 3. 

[Mark_T]

I'm sure those onboard are following the developments as best they can with internet and calls from home.

 

I have no doubt that those not currently ill will want nothing more than to get out of Florida as quickly as possible and hopefully still be health and uninfected by the time they get home.

 

Only reason they will be in Florida longer than that is if they are prevented from leaving by any requirements for quarantine.

 

As for what other national governments are doing to help, I'd imagine they most want to know where their people are going to be so they can make the necessary arrangements, but instead of having a week to prepare as would have been the case if this somewhat embarrassing foot-shuffling wasn't happening, the debate is going to force things down to the wire before they get a chance to get ready...

 

As for costs, and I'm staggered it even ranks as a question right now, you can be sure that all the UK/EU passengers will be carrying robust insurance as it is normal and expected that any hospitalization in the USA would cost them dearly otherwise...

 

I hope this can reach a swift conclusion so everyone can actually move forward with the necessary preparations before the ships come over the horizon... 

[rajkr74]

Also picked up the comment from Burk at the Broward Co. meeting that there are two passengers who are very sick on the Zaandam that they were requesting be medivaced off the ship to Mexico but MX declined the request.  He also stated that they would need immediate medical attention in Ft. Lauderdale "if they made there". 

Very sad situation.

[sansterre]

21 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

 

He's got a lot of weight on his shoulders in that meeting today! Dealing with politicians! 😉

 

He's actually semi-correct with his March 8th answer. Zaanie's prior "around the horn" cruise concluded on March 6th in Buenos Aires. The "current" voyage official commenced on March 7 with an overnight in BA. She left on March 8th to go "across" to Montevideo, Uruguay where she arrived on March 9.

 

 

Zaandam	3/6/2020	Fri	BUENOS AIRES
Zaandam	3/7/2020	Sat	BUENOS AIRES
Zaandam	3/8/2020	Sun	Buenos Aires
Zaandam	3/9/2020	Mon	Montevideo
Zaandam	3/10/2020	Tue	At Sea (South Atlantic Ocean)
Zaandam	3/11/2020	Wed	At Sea
Zaandam	3/12/2020	Thu	Port Stanley
Zaandam	3/13/2020	Fri	Scenic cruising Strait of Magellan
Zaandam	3/14/2020	Sat	Punta Arenas
Zaandam	3/15/2020	Sun	Ushuaia
Zaandam	3/16/2020	Mon	Scenic cruising Cape Horn
Zaandam	3/17/2020	Tue	Scenic cruising Sarmiento Channel
Zaandam	3/18/2020	Wed	Scenic cruising Chilean Fjords
Zaandam	3/19/2020	Thu	Puerto Montt
Zaandam	3/20/2020	Fri	At Sea (South Pacific Ocean)
Zaandam	3/21/2020	Sat	SAN ANTONIO (SANTIAGO)

🙂Dealing with politicians -  it reminds me of a few years ago when I was a County Commissioner in Central Florida.  But we never took a recess right when it was time for a vote.  And the 10 minute recess has now become their lunch hour while we all wait to make sure Broward County will welcome the HAL ships.

Edited March 31, 2020 by sansterre

[3rdGenCunarder]

Just now, sansterre said:

🙂 it reminds me of a few years ago when I was a County Commissioner in Central Florida.  But we never took a recess right when it was time for a vote.  And the 10 minute recess has now become their lunch hour while we all wait to make sure Broward County will welcome the HAL ships.

 

Might there be some behind-the scenes discussions to sway voters who appear to be on the fence?

[Copper10-8]

They're back in session. well.....almost

Edited March 31, 2020 by Copper10-8

[Vict0riann]

Looks like they are back in?

 

Copper you are just too speedy for me!

Edited March 31, 2020 by Vict0riann

[Sunshine3601]

IMO Port of Everglades and Miami have been dealing with other cruise ships with sick crew, etc.    There are other ports in the US and I said before I find Galveston to be the best option at this time.    Ultimately, the decision is not in our hands and we will just have to wait and see how this plays out.    I am confident the US will step in and assist as we always do and will.     If they head to Galveston it would be a shorter trip as it sounds as though there are some patients in need of medical help Now!    Everyone is in my thoughts and prayers.    Stay Well!

[Copper10-8]

Meanwhile, the two sisters find themselves just southwest of Grand Cayman

 

https://www.vesselfinder.com/?imo=9156527

[Nymich]

Nearly an hour 10 minute break.  Maybe they had lunch and came up with some answers.   Watching the Grand Princess disembark in Oakland was a huge production  Easy to say what to do and very hard to do.

[Aquahound]

22 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

Might there be some behind-the scenes discussions to sway voters who appear to be on the fence?

 

There never truly is a recess in discussions like this....only things that don't want to be said on camera.  Trust me.  I've been there. 

Edited March 31, 2020 by Aquahound

[rjbean4]

Just found this also. Well, we have ships here at Port Tampa Bay too but not like the ports on the east coast. Carnival Legend, Carnival Paradise and Rhapsody of the Seas are currently docked at Sparkman Warf. Formely known as Channelside where the Florida Aquarium and American Victory ship are located. Also just down the street from Amalie Arena which is home to the Tampa Bay Lightning as mom and I are very long term STM's. This area is also adjacent to Downtown Tampa. Lots of construction going on thanks to Mr. Vinik (Owner of the Lightning, GO BOLTS) and his group to revitalize the downtown area and also for next years Superbowl. Docked over in the East Bay area next to Hwy 41 is the Norwegian Dawn. Currently out at the anchorage in the gulf is the Brilliance of the Seas. These ships sail from Tampa year round/seasonally. Also at the anchorage currently is the Celebrity Summit and Celebrity Infinity. These two actually have been sailing from Port Everglades and if necessary I think could get in under the Skyway Bridge. There has also been a  3rd Celebrity ship (Silhouette) that has also been out there but they are currently en route to Port Everglades probably for fuel and provisions. The 3 Celebrity ships off our shores have taken turns doing this. So back to the situation involving the Insignia, sure we will have room for them somewhere. Tampa has a pretty large cargo port area and there is also Port Manatee if necessary as the number of  cruise ship pier facilities here are not like they are in Ft. Lauderdale & Miami.

 

I just hope something for everyone involving the Zaandam and Rotterdam is figured out. Sooner the better.

 

Below is a link for everyone to see what is going on in Florida. Yes this does confirm the situation in South Florida and its being updated regularly. Our numbers in the Tampa area are rising but they are not what they are in the Ft. Lauderdale/Miami area and we have good friends that are down in the northern part of Palm Beach county. Yes there has been a lot of talk as to why Desantis has not ordered a lock down in the whole state and he as done everything else with the incoming flights and checkpoints at the border. Just in case he changes his mind we already had a pretty full supply of everything but went out yesterday to get more so mom and I are way ready if necessary. We also have family in Minnesota as that is were we are from originally and if i'm not mistaken their confirmed case numbers are less but they are under a statewide lockdown. Rising numbers in neighboring states could be reasons for this. 

 

 https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/96dd742462124fa0b38ddedb9b25e429

Edited March 31, 2020 by rjbean4

[Nymich]

3 minutes ago, Aquahound said:

 

There never truly is a recess in discussions like this....only things that don't want to be said on camera.  Trust me.  I've been there. 

I trust you.

[Copper10-8]

Are we done with Carnival Corp/HAL/Zaandam/Rotterdam?

[sansterre]

34 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

Might there be some behind-the scenes discussions to sway voters who appear to be on the fence?

NO!  To do so would be both inappropriate and against the Florida Sunshine Law.  

If two or more commissioners were together for lunch, our county lawyer would usually hang with them to be sure no current issues were discussed.

Edited March 31, 2020 by sansterre

[Nymich]

3 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

Are we done with Carnival Corp/HAL/Zaandam/Rotterdam?

Not sure but it is a County with over 2 million people and over 13 million visitors every year.  They have a ton on their plate right now.   They are talking about ships again right now but who knows how long.

[sansterre]

6 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

Are we done with Carnival Corp/HAL/Zaandam/Rotterdam?

Did I miss a vote?  Was there more discussion?

[Cruisin Kay D]

Could someone repost the meeting link?

 

[Nymich]

Just now, sansterre said:

Did I miss a vote?  Was there more discussion?

No vote yet they are trying to handle county business right now.