Electronic Muster Drills

[jhannah]

Royal Caribbean has filed a patent for EMUSTER ... possible electronic safety drills before sailing. It would take place on your cabin's interactive TV screen. This would certainly be a welcomed relief from cramming up on deck, which is about as anti-social-distancing as you can get.

What do you think of the concept? Do you think Holland America will follow suit with a similar program? 

[KirkNC]

I think from a maritime safety perspective it’s a horrible idea.  In a real emergency people would be clueless about where and how to get to their lifeboat.

 

if your goal is social distancing, don't cruise.

[rkacruiser]

From a standpoint of trying to enforce social distancing, it's an idea worth considering.  But, I think refinement of the concept is required.

 

#1:  How would attendance at such a Muster be enforced?  (How many totally ignore the safety video repeated endlessly on Embarkation Day and during the first 1-2 days of the voyage?)

 

#2:  Knowing where to go to Muster, the best route to take because you have taken that route (those maps on the back of the stateroom doors would not suffice in an emergency):  this is important!  Consider the Costa Concordia accident:  many had just embarked, had not had a Muster Drill, and had no clue as to where to go or what to do.  (The confusion on the part of their crew--thanks at least in part to their Captain--did not help.)

 

 

[RocketMan275]

Perhaps a better idea would be the concept used on our last cruise on Oasis.

We had an assigned 'rally point' where every one in our groups was to meet.

Ours was the aqua theater.

We had to check in and they ran our cruise card through a reader.

At that point we were allowed to sit in an assigned area for our group.

We did not go to the life boat but we were told if it was anticipated that we would need to man the lifeboats a RCCI employee would guide our group by the best, safest, and swiftest path.

Other groups meet in the MDR, various bars and entertainment venues.

 

Much more civilized process.

Groups could be managed better and much better than standing for a long period of time.

 

Our last Holland muster was a fiasco.

We were in one large mass.  Couldn't see the crew person conducting the drill

We were in front of a big fan and couldn't hear either.

 

[FlaMariner]

7 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Perhaps a better idea would be the concept used on our last cruise on Oasis.

We had an assigned 'rally point' where every one in our groups was to meet.

Ours was the aqua theater.

We had to check in and they ran our cruise card through a reader.

At that point we were allowed to sit in an assigned area for our group.

We did not go to the life boat but we were told if it was anticipated that we would need to man the lifeboats a RCCI employee would guide our group by the best, safest, and swiftest path.

Other groups meet in the MDR, various bars and entertainment venues.

 

Much more civilized process.

Groups could be managed better and much better than standing for a long period of time.

 

Our last Holland muster was a fiasco.

We were in one large mass.  Couldn't see the crew person conducting the drill

We were in front of a big fan and couldn't hear either.

 

The muster experience you had on the Oasis was our same experience on the Nieuw Statendam last October.......We were herded into the Main Showstage theatre and sat according to our muster station number....We were scanned when we entered with out key card. We then went thru a safety presentation and if this was for real, we'd all be ready to follow the HAL staff assigned to our area to our lifeboat.  

 

It worked well and seemed like a great way to make sure we knew where to go and what to do.

 

 

[KirkNC]

The Pinnacle ships have no promenade to speak of so they have to hold the muster inside.  Not sure how that translates in an emergency.

[rkacruiser]

This mustering concept in a large public room seems guest friendly as I have experienced it on MSC Meraviglia and Nieuw Statendam.  How would such a situation truly play out if the Captain orders "Abandon Ship"?  So many people; some few crew members to control the number of guests particularly as I saw on Nieuw Statendam in the World Stage and in Meraviglia's Main Theater.

 

I know that the USCG approves of the abandon ship plans of the cruise lines and I know that drills are done--with crew--to demonstrate that it can be done within the proper time frame.

 

With the increasing number of the guests, I have to wonder:  is the current Muster Plans for any vessel really realistic?  

[bouhunter]

4 hours ago, KirkNC said:

I think from a maritime safety perspective it’s a horrible idea.  In a real emergency people would be clueless about where and how to get to their lifeboat.

 

if your goal is social distancing, don't cruise.

Exactly. 

[john2003]

I agree with the concern about new era muster drills. Even on the non- Pinnacle ships, the stay in your stateroom until called approach worries me. Will people really want to be in their cabin if they know there is an emergency?  Personally I would prefer to be at my boat station. 

 

It should not be managed for our convenience although I fully support providing alternatives where the approach is physically too onerous. 

 

I think the entire industry has demonstrated an arrogance that is not supported by history. Hence we prefer small to mid-size ships. Despite earning my retirement from a career in IT, I also like the paper and pencil approach to record keeping in this instance. This makes me at best in the minority but more probably a dinosaur. 

[rtgirard]

Princess  and Norwegian have been doing drills that way for at least 2 years now...it seemed like HAL was the only line we have cruised that was still requiring people to stand on the deck...usually waiting for those certain "special" passengers who always arrive late!

[ski ww]

People don't pay attention as it is, at least if you're standing by your life boat you know how to get there in a real emergency. Next time you're on an airplane look around to see how many people are paying attention to the safety demo. 

[Krazy Kruizers]

It sounds like a good idea.  But will need a lot of refining.

[YXU AC*SE]

Actually, there is a bit more to the patent than TV -- basically it is a pushing of muster messages, including video playback of a muster drill video to your smart phone, and using your phone to track your check-in to the muster station (images are from the granted patent 10,582,335)  You would still need to attend, but you could do over a longer period of time -- moreso crowd management.    Scott. 

 

 

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by YXU AC*SE

[cruisemom42]

HAL seems to be one of the few lines (at least of those I've sailed on) that actually holds their muster outside, by the lifeboat stations. Even that seems to be changing for their larger ships. Most hold them in large lounges, MDR, or other gathering points.

 

I've asked about the relative safety of the difference before (aboard ship) and one reason given for gathering inside is that, in the case of an actual emergency it is exceedingly rare for passengers to need to go directly to their lifeboat station. Often when there is an emergency, it may be hours before an "abandon ship" order is actually given -- for example if there is a fire onboard the ship that may end up being controlled (or not).  It is much safer for passengers to be told to muster in these inside locations, especially if there is rough weather outside. (Or that is the rationale.) 

 

Personally, I do think holding the muster outside comes with its own confusions. People tend to pay less attention than when they are indoors and can sit while someone is addressing them. And you cannot convince me that new cruisers on the ship only a few hours are going to remember their way to a particular muster station (which number was it again?) when the whole ship is new to them. Whereas you are likely to remember how to get to the MDR or a lounge that you visit daily for shows.

 

As to doing a virtual muster, it's uncharted territory. But at the end of the day there are some who are not going to pay attention no matter where the muster is held, and there are those who diligently pay attention and will go and located their muster station on their own. And, of course, many folks in between....

 

(And re: the airplane safety analogy -- they only brief you. The don't make you don a safety jacket and stand on the wing....)

 

 

[rafinmd]

16 minutes ago, YXU AC*SE said:

Actually, there is a bit more to the patent than TV -- basically it is a pushing of muster messages, including video playback of a muster drill video to your smart phone, and using your phone to track your check-in to the muster station (images are from the granted patent 10,582,335)  You would still need to attend, but you could do over a longer period of time -- moreso crowd management.    Scott. 

 

 

 

And what if the passenger does not have a smart phone?

 

Roy

[YXU AC*SE]

2 minutes ago, rafinmd said:

And what if the passenger does not have a smart phone?  Roy

 

They are reminded it's 2020 and are not permitted to board (or alternately are handed stone tablets upon check-in with their muster instructions)  🙂         Scott. 

 

 

[TiogaCruiser]

So with on a ship with 3000 pax, that’s 3000 connections ( assuming all have capable devices).......  

[VMax1700]

As far as I remember when the emergency alarm sounds passengers must return to their staterooms to collect lifejackets, warm clothing, meds etc. and wait there for further instructions.  This makes being in your stateroom watching a safety video quite sensible as it ties the two actions together in the passengers mind.  With Pax in their staterooms any further actions could be scheduled by deck or area and guided to lifeboats etc.

 

We have found the 'indoors' drills on Koningsdam to be quite civilized apart from the slow crawl down the stairways.  Our musters have been in MDR or Pinnacle Grill. Much better than the outside ones.

[crusinbanjo]

2 hours ago, ski ww said:

People don't pay attention as it is, at least if you're standing by your life boat you know how to get there in a real emergency. Next time you're on an airplane look around to see how many people are paying attention to the safety demo. 

Two things I always do on cruise ships and airplanes.  Pay attention to the briefing to remind myself how it works AND always know where the exit is in relationship to where I am, ie: (cabin or seat), and the best route in case of emergency, lifeboat etc..  

I do think the lifeboat drills are important and people don't pay a close attention as is necessary.  I also think the crew and ships officers take it a little to lightly.  Mrs Banjo and I on a recent cruise were assigned to a lifeboat station without a lifeboat!  When I asked what the plan would be in an emergency, the snarky answer, (paraphrasing here), that we will break up the group and bring them to some other lifeboat if necessary, was totally unacceptable to me.  In a real emergency 150 panicking people and nervous crew would be hard to control.   After I insisted to speak with the safety officer, we were reassigned to a other lifeboat.  Don't think other Pax or crew were as concerned. 

[KirkNC]

Thirty two people died on the Costa Concordia in their cabins.  The ship rolled and sank in about 30 minutes, no time to muster inside or outside.  In the end it was pretty much every man for themselves.  Imagine this on a 5,000 passenger ship.

[Sir PMP]

17 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

Perhaps a better idea would be the concept used on our last cruise on Oasis.

We had an assigned 'rally point' where every one in our groups was to meet.

Ours was the aqua theater.

We had to check in and they ran our cruise card through a reader.

At that point we were allowed to sit in an assigned area for our group.

We did not go to the life boat but we were told if it was anticipated that we would need to man the lifeboats a RCCI employee would guide our group by the best, safest, and swiftest path.

Other groups meet in the MDR, various bars and entertainment venues.

 

Much more civilized process.

Groups could be managed better and much better than standing for a long period of time.

 

Our last Holland muster was a fiasco.

We were in one large mass.  Couldn't see the crew person conducting the drill

We were in front of a big fan and couldn't hear either.

 

Must have a big HAl ship...

[Sir PMP]

10 hours ago, rtgirard said:

Princess  and Norwegian have been doing drills that way for at least 2 years now...it seemed like HAL was the only line we have cruised that was still requiring people to stand on the deck...usually waiting for those certain "special" passengers who always arrive late!

That's why we sail HAL...

[rtgirard]

We love HAL, but if you routinely sail in summer, it can get very hot standing on the deck waiting for people who always arrive late.  Would rather they wait 10 minutes and then go ahead...make the late ones attend a separate briefing.

[ontheweb]

3 hours ago, rafinmd said:

And what if the passenger does not have a smart phone?

 

Roy

I was going to ask the same thing.

[catl331]

4 hours ago, rafinmd said:

And what if the passenger does not have a smart phone?

 

20 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I was going to ask the same thing.

 

I can see it being done with a "smart" (i.e. wifi enabled) TV.