Carnival update

[Adawn47]

11 hours ago, wowzz said:

Selbourne - I agree with much of what you say, but deaths directly due to CV19 are now in single figures. 

However, deaths from heart attacks, cancer,  reduced organ transplants etc have increased dramatically over the last 6 months.

It's not an easy judgement to make, but society has to start to prioritise.  The economy needs to recover, sick people need to get treatment and be seen by doctors and admitted to hospital. Those with underlying symptoms that may be at risk due to CV19  will obviously still need to take precautionary measures. 

I think we may need to have a new reality whereby the vast majority of the population carry  on as before, with certain restrictions,  and the susceptible live a more restricted lifestyle, based on their own personal risk assessment.

 

I've read through your post twice wowzz.  Once, because I was surprised at how much my thoughts had changed from the outset of this pandemic, and the second time in more detail just to make sure😉. I can remember much earlier on when the forum was in full flow,  discussing this pandemic and how we all perceived the outcome would be. I seemed to disagree with your ideas a lot then, but as the months go on I find myself slowly and worryingly beginning to agree with you. Mostly😉😆

Avril 

[davecttr]

1 hour ago, terrierjohn said:

That is a rather pointless and defeatist attitude to take mercury, you may wish to bury your head in the sand and await Armageddon, personally I would prefer to explore every possible solution until the problem is solved.

COVID-19 is not listening to anybody, it does not have a brain. 

 

 

[zap99]

3 hours ago, davecttr said:

With age differences being the most important determinant in COVID mortality I fear a distopian future where the elderly are banished to 'COVID colonies'. On your 50's birthday you get a knock on the door and you are carted off to a 'facility' for your protection. Make a run for it and the contact tracers track you down.

 

You could make a film about it 😟

 

Meanwhile a few billion more people get COVID and it mutates into a more deadly form which back infects the clear areas. Result 😱

This is how the walking dead started. Just saying. Watch out. 🤔

[AnnieC]

1 hour ago, AndyMichelle said:

That's the key Cathy, if the staff wear masks or shields, it makes the customer not wanting to be the odd one out. 

I hope business is going well and continues to do so. 

Andy 

Around here very few staff wearing masks - a small minority in Sainsbury's and Tesco and that's it. Plus not a single staff member wearing a mask in any of the three pub restaurants I've been in recently. Can understand that it would not be pleasant wearing one all day, but not sure why the customers are expected to protect the staff but not the other way round; very happy to be enlightened, though, by those who know far more than I do.

[terrierjohn]

27 minutes ago, davecttr said:

COVID-19 is not listening to anybody, it does not have a brain. 

 

 

Yes but we humans do and we have solved far greater problems than Covid19 over the years.

[Oulton Jim]

I am in agreement with Wowzz. The critical figures are those of the new cases - and importantly that those who are asymptomatic are picked up by mass testing. It is noticeable that for 6 weeks now [in UK] the number of deaths is below the average taken over the previous 5 years, so we need to get this in perspective. 

Edited August 6, 2020 by Oulton Jim

[DamianG]

13 hours ago, grapau27 said:

In the large supermarkets and shopping outlets up here 100%.compliance.

My sales calls are independent convenience stores and mask wearing by customers was minimal in these.

Independent shops need the business plus none of the owners were wearing masks either.

 

I have found the same thing on my shopping visits. The only people I've seen without masks in our local supermarkets are some checkout staff (sat behind screens) and occasionally teenagers.

In contrast, I had to go to a poorer area of Leeds on Monday to buy some school shirts for Kyle (the only shop in Leeds that stocks them) and I stuck out like a sore thumb with my face mask and gloves. None of the staff or clients were wearing them and I was shocked to say the least.

[Josy1953]

29 minutes ago, AnnieC said:

Around here very few staff wearing masks - a small minority in Sainsbury's and Tesco and that's it. Plus not a single staff member wearing a mask in any of the three pub restaurants I've been in recently. Can understand that it would not be pleasant wearing one all day, but not sure why the customers are expected to protect the staff but not the other way round; very happy to be enlightened, though, by those who know far more than I do.

Same here in Sainsbury and Tesco regards staff but when I was in Sainsbury last week every customer was wearing a mask and Tesco this week only 1 person without a mask.

[Hampshire Steve]

I stopped off at the Motorway services this morning for fuel, and whilst I didn't need to go into the shop as I have an APP on the phone for paying, I noticed that everyone coming in and out of the shop were wearing a mask but the staff were not, OK for those behind the counter with a screen but how about the one re-stacking shelves?

 

In our business we don't rely on walk in trade so have kept our front door locked since this started, would I open the door now if people were wearing a mask? No is the answer, you can't rely on everyone working to the same aim.

[Dermotsgirl]

44 minutes ago, Oulton Jim said:

I am in agreement with Wowzz. The critical figures are those of the new cases - and importantly that those who are asymptomatic are picked up by mass testing. It is noticeable that for 6 weeks now [in UK] the number of deaths is below the average taken over the previous 5 years, so we need to get this in perspective. 

When looking at that chart for the average excess deaths this year, don’t forget to look at April - that gives a very sobering perspective. 

 

It is a relief that deaths have reduced to a normal normal level, but without extreme care and vigilance, those deaths could easily rise again There’s always a lag on deaths. If cases are now rising, deaths might also rise in 3 - 4 weeks time. 

 

We can’t afford to get complacent just because things look ok right now

[funinhounslow]

1 hour ago, AnnieC said:

Around here very few staff wearing masks - a small minority in Sainsbury's and Tesco and that's it. Plus not a single staff member wearing a mask in any of the three pub restaurants I've been in recently. Can understand that it would not be pleasant wearing one all day, but not sure why the customers are expected to protect the staff but not the other way round; very happy to be enlightened, though, by those who know far more than I do.

Here you go...

 

Face coverings are not required for employees in indoor settings [...] where face coverings have to be worn by members of the public This also applies to banks, building societies and post office staff.

This is because employees should continue to follow guidance from their employer based on a workplace health and safety assessment

 

Source 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own#face-coverings-at-work

[AnnieC]

9 minutes ago, funinhounslow said:

Here you go...

 

Face coverings are not required for employees in indoor settings [...] where face coverings have to be worn by members of the public This also applies to banks, building societies and post office staff.

This is because employees should continue to follow guidance from their employer based on a workplace health and safety assessment

 

Source 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own#face-coverings-at-work

Thanks for that - I understand that staff don't have to wear face coverings. What I still don't understand is the rationale behind the rule.

[Adawn47]

56 minutes ago, DamianG said:

 

I have found the same thing on my shopping visits. The only people I've seen without masks in our local supermarkets are some checkout staff (sat behind screens) and occasionally teenagers.

In contrast, I had to go to a poorer area of Leeds on Monday to buy some school shirts for Kyle (the only shop in Leeds that stocks them) and I stuck out like a sore thumb with my face mask and gloves. None of the staff or clients were wearing them and I was shocked to say the least.

That will be why Leeds cases are rising sharply again and are on the watch list for local lockdown, and then they wonder why!!!  Complacency, that's why.

Avril 

 

[Adawn47]

14 minutes ago, funinhounslow said:

Here you go...

 

Face coverings are not required for employees in indoor settings [...] where face coverings have to be worn by members of the public This also applies to banks, building societies and post office staff.

This is because employees should continue to follow guidance from their employer based on a workplace health and safety assessment

 

Source 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own#face-coverings-at-work

So I read that as " we can infect you but you can't infect us" or in layman's terms 

" I'm alright Jack"😷

Avril 

[tring]

16 hours ago, molecrochip said:

I was talking to someone from Public Health England the other day. Covid is going to hang around like flu does from year to year. It will become a fact of life that people get Covid on holiday like people get the flu or norovirus.

 

We don't need to have a vaccine, we just need to work out ways to minimise transmission and restore those who catch it to full health quickly.

 

You’ll notice that the number of serious cases, assisted breathing and deaths, are still going down yet the number of cases are going up slightly. That’s because we are learning how to fight it.

 

A vaccine will be a big win but learning to reduce the effects of infection are just as important.

 

 

 

 

 

That is what Chris Whitty and Patrick Valance were saying all along, we either need a vaccine or a good treatment/avoidance of it.  There is no vaccine for malaria, although many attemps have been made over the years, but there are methods of dealing with it as we all know.  The fear of malaria is not something that stops us travelling.

[wowzz]

2 hours ago, Adawn47 said:

seemed to disagree with your ideas a lot then, but as the months go on I find myself slowly and worryingly beginning to agree with you. Mostly😉😆

Avril 

Careful Avril, you'll soon be in total agreement with me!

[grapau27]

3 hours ago, Cathygh said:

Not sure how we got on to Harrogate but it's one of my favourite places. DH was born there and we still visit family, usually combining it with the Home and Gift Show but sadly not this year. Betty's is over rated IMHO. We quite like a Turkish Restaurant, I think it's called Istanbul Grill. 

I can report 100% compliance with masks in my shop, including staff. We are in a little arcade and occasionally people forget to one on but quickly catch on.😷

And for those of you who are reps/ agents, I admire the driving you do, hundreds of miles for a minimum order, and never complaining

Cathy

 

Harrogate today.

 

 

[Ardennais]

2 hours ago, terrierjohn said:

Yes but we humans do and we have solved far greater problems than Covid19 over the years.

I can’t think of many greater problems in my lifetime. 

[grapau27]

55 minutes ago, AnnieC said:

Thanks for that - I understand that staff don't have to wear face coverings. What I still don't understand is the rationale behind the rule.

+1

[grapau27]

1 hour ago, funinhounslow said:

Here you go...

 

Face coverings are not required for employees in indoor settings [...] where face coverings have to be worn by members of the public This also applies to banks, building societies and post office staff.

This is because employees should continue to follow guidance from their employer based on a workplace health and safety assessment

 

Source 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own#face-coverings-at-work

Ridiculous.

Staff should wear masks or at least plastic visors otherwise they could be infecting customers.

[Snow Hill]

1 minute ago, grapau27 said:

Ridiculous.

Staff should wear masks or at least plastic visors otherwise they could be infecting customers.

My daughter in law is a store manager at Next, all her staff are wearing visors in store. 

[grapau27]

Just now, Snow Hill said:

My daughter in law is a store manager at Next, all her staff are wearing visors in store. 

👍

[Adawn47]

15 minutes ago, Ardennais said:

I can’t think of many greater problems in my lifetime. 

Not in your lifetime maybe, but in general. The biggest  I can think of 

straightaway is penicillin. Not the problem,  but the cure of many deadly infections.

Avril 

Edited August 6, 2020 by Adawn47

[AndyMichelle]

2 minutes ago, Snow Hill said:

My daughter in law is a store manager at Next, all her staff are wearing visors in store. 

Good on her 

[Snow Hill]

51 minutes ago, tring said:

 

That is what Chris Whitty and Patrick Valance were saying all along, we either need a vaccine or a good treatment/avoidance of it.  There is no vaccine for malaria, although many attemps have been made over the years, but there are methods of dealing with it as we all know.  The fear of malaria is not something that stops us travelling.

Malaria is neither a virus nor a bacteria, so unlikely vaccination or inoculation would work any way, its a single celled parasite. The focus has been on the environment to reduce the chance of the mosquito that carries it becoming infected itself.

 

https://ada.com/conditions/malaria/