Next announcement of cancellations

[Dermotsgirl]

56 minutes ago, wowzz said:

Interesting link here. Saga bosses are saying they don't expect cruises to restart until April at the earliest.

https://www.fool.co.uk/investing/2020/09/11/saga-shares-crashed-on-thursday-heres-what-you-need-to-know/

An April restart sounds like a reasonable aspiration. Get the winter out of the way, and hope the virus recedes when people spend more time outside. 

[KnowTheScore]

42 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

Oh dear, another 3500 cases today.  That's double what it has been in the last few weeks.  It's not going well.

 

 

Well, if they perform more testing then quite obviously they will identify more cases.  Just more of the same scaremongering imo.

 

Was notable too that in his special announcement, Boris expressly told people "only get tested if you have symptoms"

 

Here are his exact quotes taken from the transcript of his briefing:

 

"Fourth, if you have COVID symptoms, get a test and self-isolate. We are now processing 1.2 million tests a week. To date we have carried out 15.4 million antigen tests – that’s more than any other country in Europe, and more per head than other European countries like Germany and Spain. We are increasing our testing capacity further to meet rising demand. You can help by only booking a test if you have a fever, a new continuous cough, or you’ve lost your sense of taste or smell – if you don’t have those symptoms and haven’t been asked to book a test, please don’t."   What this means is that the government is not remotely interested in testing healthy people and thus revealing the HUGE numbers of people who have had Covid and not had any issues with it, which is at least 80%-90% of people who've had it. Testing only those people who are known to be ill is both disingenuous and misleading.   None of the figures being published can be taken at face value sadly.  The whole thing has become a total farce.

Edited September 12, 2020 by KnowTheScore

[Gettingwarmer]

It is said in today’s papers that too many people are going for tests with no symptoms and taking up places for those with symptoms. That  is why they are now emphasising only get tested if you have symptoms to clear spaces. 

[jeanlyon]

Yes agree.  We are getting a lot more cases, but fewer deaths which seems to mean that more younger people are getting it.  Very busy in Salcombe today.  Not a sign of social distancing at all.  However, our numbers down here are very low which is good

[KnowTheScore]

6 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

An April restart sounds like a reasonable aspiration. Get the winter out of the way, and hope the virus recedes when people spend more time outside. 

 

Wishful thinking imo

 

The advent of the annual Flu season will drive the scaremongering into a frenzy imo as lots of people come down with various symptoms which all appear to be COVID symptoms but which may simply be colds, ILIs and / or Flu.   It's going to cause lots of disruption, lots of people will have to go home and isolate and not be able to work until and unless they can get tested to prove if it's Flu or COVID one way or the other and a whole bunch of those tests will produce false-positive results causing further problems.

 

Doubtless there will be reports of increased (cough) "COVID deaths" given that the NHS guidelines expressly told doctors and coroners to basically GUESS (make a medical judgement) of whether a patient had COVID or not in the instances when there was no testing or swabbing done.  So they look at the symptoms a person had before dying and make a judgement.  I wonder what percentage will go down as COVID and what percentage as Flu when the symptoms are essentially identical?!

 

I consequently think Jan/Feb will be a frantic period and I doubt whether cruises will occur any time shortly afterward.

 

Of course I could be wrong.

 

Source Ref:  NHS Guidelines for recording deaths, Section 4 refers:

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/877302/guidance-for-doctors-completing-medical-certificates-of-cause-of-death-covid-19.pdf

.

 

 

[grapau27]

16 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

An April restart sounds like a reasonable aspiration. Get the winter out of the way, and hope the virus recedes when people spend more time outside. 

As the Mediterranean cruising season doesn't start until April/May that would seem a logical start up time especially if they don't sail in the Caribbean or Dubai.

[KnowTheScore]

12 minutes ago, Gettingwarmer said:

It is said in today’s papers that too many people are going for tests with no symptoms and taking up places for those with symptoms. That  is why they are now emphasising only get tested if you have symptoms to clear spaces. 

 

There's no logic to such a stance.  COVID mostly transmits and spreads because of asymptomatic carriers so only testing the people who already have symptoms is simply ridiculous.   If we want to do anything towards stopping the spread then you need to test EVERYONE without limitation and thereby identify the people who have it but who don't know they have it, so that they can they go and isolate rather than spread it around.  The whole thing is totally disingenuous and framed to create a scaremongering story imo.

Edited September 12, 2020 by KnowTheScore

[Adawn47]

52 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

We are not allowed to use the ships toiletries.. We have strict instructions to bring home The White Company products for the girls... 

Andy 

I think they've changed them Andy. I used to love their shower gel so stopped taking my own. Two years ago the first time I used it I developed an itchy rash. The following evening I used the one we normally use  at home, that I'd brought for Frank, and it never happened again. Cost cutting everywhere.

Avril

[terrierjohn]

1 hour ago, jeanlyon said:

Graham, you can't be allergic to nothing surely?  Anyway, yes hope they are OK.  Can't see a vaccine being available until next spring at the earliest.

I think that was the worry Jean  not the diagnosis. The illness could have been totally unrelated to the trial.

Edited September 12, 2020 by terrierjohn

[terrierjohn]

27 minutes ago, KnowTheScore said:

 

There's no logic to such a stance.  COVID mostly transmits and spreads because of asymptomatic carriers so only testing the people who already have symptoms is simply ridiculous.   If we want to do anything towards stopping the spread then you need to test EVERYONE without limitation and thereby identify the people who have it but who don't know they have it, so that they can they go and isolate rather than spread it around.  The whole thing is totally disingenuous and framed to create a scaremongering story imo.

That would require testing capacity in the millions, and we are currently struggling to meet 200,000, and of course everyone would need testing at least weekly if not daily  since you could be infected at any time.  So I think mass testing is a pipe dream, or at least a moonshot.

[Dermotsgirl]

35 minutes ago, KnowTheScore said:

 

Wishful thinking imo

 

The advent of the annual Flu season will drive the scaremongering into a frenzy imo as lots of people come down with various symptoms which all appear to be COVID symptoms but which may simply be colds, ILIs and / or Flu.   It's going to cause lots of disruption, lots of people will have to go home and isolate and not be able to work until and unless they can get tested to prove if it's Flu or COVID one way or the other and a whole bunch of those tests will produce false-positive results causing further problems.

 

Doubtless there will be reports of increased (cough) "COVID deaths" given that the NHS guidelines expressly told doctors and coroners to basically GUESS (make a medical judgement) of whether a patient had COVID or not in the instances when there was no testing or swabbing done.  So they look at the symptoms a person had before dying and make a judgement.  I wonder what percentage will go down as COVID and what percentage as Flu when the symptoms are essentially identical?!

 

I consequently think Jan/Feb will be a frantic period and I doubt whether cruises will occur any time shortly afterward.

 

Of course I could be wrong.

 

Source Ref:  NHS Guidelines for recording deaths, Section 4 refers:

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/877302/guidance-for-doctors-completing-medical-certificates-of-cause-of-death-covid-19.pdf

.

 

 

Note that I said ‘aspiration’. I didn’t actually say it was going to happen.

 

I agree with you, this winter has potential to be hellish.... and COVID is just the half of it😱

[Dermotsgirl]

36 minutes ago, KnowTheScore said:

 

There's no logic to such a stance.  COVID mostly transmits and spreads because of asymptomatic carriers so only testing the people who already have symptoms is simply ridiculous.   If we want to do anything towards stopping the spread then you need to test EVERYONE without limitation and thereby identify the people who have it but who don't know they have it, so that they can they go and isolate rather than spread it around.  The whole thing is totally disingenuous and framed to create a scaremongering story imo.

Moonshot.

At this point in the proceedings it’s just pie in the sky 

[Dermotsgirl]

20 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

I think they've changed them Andy. I used to love their shower gel so stopped taking my own. Two years ago the first time I used it I developed an itchy rash. The following evening I used the one we normally use  at home, that I'd brought for Frank, and it never happened again. Cost cutting everywhere.

Avril

I bring the toiletries home and sell them on eBay! 

[Bazrat]

18 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

I think they've changed them Andy. I used to love their shower gel so stopped taking my own. Two years ago the first time I used it I developed an itchy rash. The following evening I used the one we normally use  at home, that I'd brought for Frank, and it never happened again. Cost cutting everywhere.

Avril

The company who supplied P&O with the toiletries I would doubt they would alter there product because if you get a bad reputation than they would lose sales.

[Adawn47]

7 minutes ago, Bazrat said:

The company who supplied P&O with the toiletries I would doubt they would alter there product because if you get a bad reputation than they would lose sales.

I don't think it said The White Company on them, but I could be wrong.   It has been known on the odd occasion😁

Avril

[Eddie99]

2 hours ago, jeanlyon said:

Bit confused here.  If the person's illness was due to side effects, they could not have been in the placebo group?  There would be nothing to have side effects from.

If I’ve understood correctly, the Covid vaccine is “piggy-backed” onto a dead/inert meningitis vaccine for introduction to the body.  Therefore the reaction might be to meningitis?

 

Who knows?  Way above my pay grade 

[Goosebear Mum]

2 hours ago, KnowTheScore said:

 

What this means is that the government is not remotely interested in testing healthy people and thus revealing the HUGE numbers of people who have had Covid and not had any issues with it, which is at least 80%-90% of people who've had it. Testing only those people who are known to be ill is both disingenuous and misleading.

 

The test only says if you HAVE it, not if you HAD it. 

 

[Adawn47]

2 hours ago, Eddie99 said:

If I’ve understood correctly, the Covid vaccine is “piggy-backed” onto a dead/inert meningitis vaccine for introduction to the body.  Therefore the reaction might be to meningitis?

 

Who knows?  Way above my pay grade 

This is sounding worse the more I read. It might be safer to risk covid

Avril

[cruisenewbie1976]

3 hours ago, Eddie99 said:

If I’ve understood correctly, the Covid vaccine is “piggy-backed” onto a dead/inert meningitis vaccine for introduction to the body.  Therefore the reaction might be to meningitis?

 

Who knows?  Way above my pay grade 

Are you sure you're not getting confused with the placebo used in the oxford trial, which is a meningitis vaccine? The actual covid vaccine has nothing to do with meningitis, as far as I'm aware. It uses an inactive adenovirus vector.

[Roger88]

8 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

Are you sure you're not getting confused with the placebo used in the oxford trial, which is a meningitis vaccine? The actual covid vaccine has nothing to do with meningitis, as far as I'm aware. It uses an inactive adenovirus vector.

Covid vaccine is basically another flue vaccine, only transformed to fight this particular covid. All flues are considered covid-type viruses. The new one has not yet been studied well. Well, Russia has already come up with a vaccine. Lets see how it works on their population before taking ourselves. 

[davecttr]

21 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

Are you sure you're not getting confused with the placebo used in the oxford trial, which is a meningitis vaccine? The actual covid vaccine has nothing to do with meningitis, as far as I'm aware. It uses an inactive adenovirus vector.

Correct, the placebo used in the Oxford vaccine is not a saline solution 🤔

 

This is interesting, the Oxford vaccine is featured

 

https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/covid-19-health/placebos-used-vaccine-trials-do-not-please-everyone

[davecttr]

21 minutes ago, Roger88 said:

Covid vaccine is basically another flue vaccine, only transformed to fight this particular covid. All flues are considered covid-type viruses. The new one has not yet been studied well. Well, Russia has already come up with a vaccine. Lets see how it works on their population before taking ourselves. 

Wrong, look it up!

Flu is caused by viruses of the Orthomyxoviridae group. COVID-19 is a coronavirus from the Orthocoronavirinae group, not the same

[grapau27]

6 minutes ago, davecttr said:

Wrong, look it up!

Flu is caused by viruses of the Orthomyxoviridae group. COVID-19 is a coronavirus from the Orthocoronavirinae group, not the same

Thanks.

This shows covid19 is different from a flu even though they are all classed as Coronaviruses.

[terrierjohn]

46 minutes ago, davecttr said:

Wrong, look it up!

Flu is caused by viruses of the Orthomyxoviridae group. COVID-19 is a coronavirus from the Orthocoronavirinae group, not the same

I believe it is the common cold that is also a coronavirus, rather than influenza.

[Chrisdriving]

I think the common cold is a Rhinovirus, bit of info here on the types.

 

https://www.healthline.com/health/common-cold-causes#coronaviruses