Negative Covid Test 72 Hours Before Boarding?

[Toofarfromthesea]

19 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

Yes, you want to be suspicious of common sense.

 

I have yet to see any face mask which was sufficiently impermeable to force exhalations to lift the edges. But I have heard a fair amount of arguments against face masks based more upon personal disinclination to wear masks than on anything approaching science,

 

Of course, virtually all science, on any topic, starts with common sense observation of things that happen.  Enough observed events is what generates data, and data is what science is based upon --- science does not spring fully formed out of dreamt-up theory.  Basing decisions concerning air-permeable face masks upon what happens with swimming goggles is hardly science.

 

Well, I'm sure you know more about science than both Fauci and that Biden team epidemiologist.

[Toofarfromthesea]

19 hours ago, clo said:

THIS^^^

 

No, it is a complete deflection from the topic - which was double masking.

[2wheelin]

On 1/29/2021 at 12:11 PM, sydbarrett said:

Yeah you can be MOST effective if you block all airways completely 😆 They are recommending us have 3 layer masks now. I can barely breathe with one good layer so home I shall stay.

I can’t post the reference here but this is the latest from MEDICAL experts.

"The variants do not affect the type of mask you need to wear. It does affect the importance of wearing a mask and ensuring that you have a good fit," Dr. Stanley Weiss, epidemiologist and professor at Rutgers New Jersey Medical School and Rutgers School of Public Health, told ABC News.

The key, experts say, is to wear a mask that fits well, and wear it consistently. In some cases, this could mean wearing an extra mask if it's tolerable, but for most, it's not necessary. So keep it simple and make sure your mask completely covers your mouth and nose, and keep it on when you can't adequately distance. ...

The key to proper mask choices is striking a balance between comfort, fit and filtration level.

"Wearing an appropriate mask with a proper fit has been effective to this point in the pandemic and will continue to be effective," said Dr. John O'Horo, infectious disease specialist at the Mayo Clinic. "If a mask doesn't' fit properly, for example, if it's loose around the nose, you're better off getting a mask with a nose wire to help with the seal than an N95 mask."

 

I have seen very few of the disposable masks worn properly. Most have a gap on the sides because they just don’t fit and people don’t know how to adjust them to fit. I’ll stick with my layered cloth mask with a filter pocket (if I choose to use it). They fit, don’t fog glasses and do not slip down when talking.

[clo]

1 hour ago, 2wheelin said:

I have seen very few of the disposable masks worn properly. Most have a gap on the sides because they just don’t fit and people don’t know how to adjust them to fit. I’ll stick with my layered cloth mask with a filter pocket (if I choose to use it). They fit, don’t fog glasses and do not slip down when talking.

We just got our N95 or whatever - KN? It's fits very well. I'm pleased so far.

[2wheelin]

1 hour ago, clo said:

We just got our N95 or whatever - KN? It's fits very well. I'm pleased so far.

Guess I should have clarified what I meant by disposable. I was referring to the green or blue pleated “surgical” masks. N95 can fit better if properly fitted but really shouldn’t be mandated. And the pleated type certainly should not be mandated over a properly constructed cloth mask.

Many institutions are still short on supplies of N95

[ed01106]

On 1/24/2021 at 2:57 PM, cruisemom42 said:

I foresee COVID testing as the next cottage industry to spring up around airports and ports. I can easily imagine some of those storefronts in the various open-air strip malls around Port Everglades becoming testing clinics for pre-cruisers....

 

I predict it will be a very short lived cottage industry with almost every cruise, county, airline etc. requiring proof of vax.  

[sydbarrett]

On 1/29/2021 at 5:48 PM, ontheweb said:

My glasses get fogged up more than enough with one mask. With more than one, I'd probably be all but legally blind.

I've resorted to not wearing my glasses and mask at the same time. I'm out here squinting like George Costanza

[clo]

9 hours ago, 2wheelin said:

Many institutions are still short on supplies of N95

It's actually KN95 masks that I got through Amazon.

[cruisemom42]

5 hours ago, ed01106 said:

I predict it will be a very short lived cottage industry with almost every cruise, county, airline etc. requiring proof of vax.  

 

The two requirements may coexist for a while.

[CruiserBruce]

44 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

The two requirements may coexist for a while.

The cottage industry is already well in progress for any airport with regular flights to Hawaii, as well as east coast airports going to Europe.

[ed01106]

1 hour ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

The two requirements may coexist for a while.

Proof of a vax *AND* a negative test.  Seems like overkill.  I could see *OR* for a couple months until vax is widely available, and once demand is met the test no longer an option.

[mom says]

56 minutes ago, ed01106 said:

Proof of a vax *AND* a negative test.  Seems like overkill.  I could see *OR* for a couple months until vax is widely available, and once demand is met the test no longer an option.

A couple of months? ??? Sorry, but I think you're dreaming.

[ed01106]

2 hours ago, mom says said:

A couple of months? ??? Sorry, but I think you're dreaming.

Not really.  Cruising starting with a testing requirement in May/June  Vax as a requirement Aug/Sept.

[mom says]

4 hours ago, ed01106 said:

Not really.  Cruising starting with a testing requirement in May/June  Vax as a requirement Aug/Sept.

So considerably more than just a couple of months. But I still think you are dreaming if you think foreign ports will be OK with just one or the other until very late in the year at the earliest. Remember that a lot of other countries will lag much further behind in getting their people vaccinated.  I think too many Americans forget that there are other countries involved in cruising too.

[clo]

3 minutes ago, mom says said:

So considerably more than just a couple of months. But I still think you are dreaming if you think foreign ports will be OK with just one or the other until very late in the year at the earliest. Remember that a lot of other countries will lag much further behind in getting their people vaccinated.  I think too many Americans forget that there are other countries involved in cruising too.

I think you're 100% right. It's going to take a monumental, worldwide effort. And governments move notoriously slowly. I have a cruise scheduled for 9/22 and can cancel into 6/22 and I have no confidence that it will go.

[ilikeanswers]

50 minutes ago, mom says said:

So considerably more than just a couple of months. But I still think you are dreaming if you think foreign ports will be OK with just one or the other until very late in the year at the earliest. Remember that a lot of other countries will lag much further behind in getting their people vaccinated.  I think too many Americans forget that there are other countries involved in cruising too.

 

I do find it surprising that people are genuinely thinking cruises are going by Easter. The roll out of the vaccine around the Caribbean is pretty slow. The latest I read the Caymans just secured 9000 Pfizer doses and that is only for the first shot. The rest of the Caribbean is yet to get anything😳. Unless you can do cruises to nowhere I can't see these islands opening up any time soon🤔:

Coronavirus (COVID-19) Vaccinations

[luckyinpa]

i havent studied the research but does getting the test 3 days before mean you cant get it on your way to the cruise terminal..airport etc. unless you isolate at the point of test i dont see the point of the testing. 

[ontheweb]

31 minutes ago, luckyinpa said:

i havent studied the research but does getting the test 3 days before mean you cant get it on your way to the cruise terminal..airport etc. unless you isolate at the point of test i dont see the point of the testing. 

The point is that it sounds proactive even if as you point out you could catch it in the next 3 days. It's the same as getting rid of the self serve buffet (which is probably a good idea for stopping norovirus), but is not really a detriment to an airborne virus. But again, it sounds good.

[CruiserBruce]

40 minutes ago, luckyinpa said:

i havent studied the research but does getting the test 3 days before mean you cant get it on your way to the cruise terminal..airport etc. unless you isolate at the point of test i dont see the point of the testing. 

Its just a basic, realistic reference point...nothing is absolute. But if you do your part...masking, handwashing, social distancing, and your test is negative, you have done all that you can, and probaby have a better than 90% of not having it when you board.

 

Hawaii has done this scheme since Oct 15, 2020, and has had very few bad outcomes...far, far less than 1 percent. And they have discovered the vast majority of their transmission is not tourists, as some would allege, but locals/residents.

[c-boy]

On 2/3/2021 at 11:52 AM, mom says said:

A couple of months? ??? Sorry, but I think you're dreaming.

here in America we like to keep it on the positive side.  Now as for Canada .... 

 

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, CruiserBruce said:

Its just a basic, realistic reference point...nothing is absolute. But if you do your part...masking, handwashing, social distancing, and your test is negative, you have done all that you can, and probaby have a better than 90% of not having it when you board.

 

Hawaii has done this scheme since Oct 15, 2020, and has had very few bad outcomes...far, far less than 1 percent. And they have discovered the vast majority of their transmission is not tourists, as some would allege, but locals/residents.

Bruce, the big difference is that if they do get a positive case in Hawaii that person is quarantined and life goes on.  But if a case slips through onto a ship it will likely end the entire cruise, possibly put thousands into quarantine, have them banned from public transportation (like airlines) for several days, etc.

 

So lets be very honest about testing.  The US Government accepts Antigen tests which have a false negative rate of up to 20%.  In addition, anyone tested with Antigen or PCR will generally test negative even if they have been infected with COVID within the previous 2-4 days.  And then, as has been posted, folks that get tested 3 days before a cruise could very well become infected at any time between when they are tested and boarding the ship.   

 

So the bottom line is that while testing sure helps, it is not going to prevent COVID getting onto ships.  Even if testing was 99% effective (and it is not) that would still mean multiple cases on almost any cruise.   That is why I have posted, since last Spring, that any testing protocol is not going to be the sole answer for the cruise industry.  They are going to need a 100% vaccination policy (for both passengers and crew) possibly reinforced with a testing protocol.

 

Hank

[CruiserBruce]

@Hlitner, most of what you said is true....but...experience is proving things to be far better than the scenarios you are mentioning. The NAAT/PCR tests that Hawaii requires run above 95% accurate. And Hawaii's experience is not up to 20% of people becoming positive. As mentioned it is far under 1%.

 

But, I agree, no situation yet proposed or used is absolutely perfect. 

[ilikeanswers]

This article is an interesting analysis of what it might take to get travel restarted:

What vaccines mean for the return of travel

[Hlitner]

2 hours ago, CruiserBruce said:

@Hlitner, most of what you said is true....but...experience is proving things to be far better than the scenarios you are mentioning. The NAAT/PCR tests that Hawaii requires run above 95% accurate. And Hawaii's experience is not up to 20% of people becoming positive. As mentioned it is far under 1%.

 

But, I agree, no situation yet proposed or used is absolutely perfect. 

As I said, lets assume testing is 99% valid.  1% of 2000 passengers is ONLY 20.  Even 1/10 of 1% would be a problem if they had COVID.  Keep in mind that cruise lines are now in the bad position of having to convince every port that ships are worth the gamble.   What would you do if you were the authority on a small island that depends on resort revenue for the economy?  Would you gamble on cruise ships?  And if a few passengers spread COVID to more of your residents (on an island with limited medical facilities) how would you deal with the situation.  Now lets consider a place like Japan (remember the Diamond Princess).  Do you think they will gamble on a cruise ship where COVID could be an issue?

 

This is just part of the challenge faced by cruise lines.   I have no idea of how it will play out...but we will be watching.

 

Hank

[ldubs]

I don't see how any amount of testing, mask wearing, quarantines, or social distancing is going to make cruises possible under the current circumstances.  We average more than 130K new cases and 3,700 deaths/day in the US.   Cruises are not going to happen, or at least should not happen until the pandemic is under control.  The vaccines seem to be the only solution to moving ahead of this thing.