Governor Just Opened Florida

[Keksie]

4 minutes ago, Pratique said:

Voluntary behavior, something Americans apparently are not good at.

Actually we are good at voluntary behavior we are not so good at draconian mandated behavior.

[CruisinNole]

14 hours ago, voyager70 said:

We're heading to FL in a few weeks for a week long beach vacation.  Lee County to be specific.  Really hope mask mandates, social distancing etc will be enforced. 

We live up the road from Lee County. The Governor's Executive Order, which I don't believe has been published yet, takes away the fines for not wearing a mask where the local governing body has a mask mandate. We live in a county without a mask mandate and I rarely see people inside stores without a mask. You should feel free to wear a mask and social distance. Our local paper had an article today in which they interviewed a number of area restaurants and nearly all of them said that they would ease into fully opening and continue to sanitize and staff would wear masks. I don't expect to see huge numbers of people throw away their masks and hand sanitizer. I really think most Floridians feel that 2,000 to 3,000 positive tests a day is not something to celebrate. 

 

I don't see this as having much of a bearing on whether or not cruising will start up from Florida. I believe that is a decision that the CDC makes, not the Governor. I'm from Miami and as much as I miss cruising and visiting family, I would not be heading down there anytime soon.

[Pratique]

2 minutes ago, CruisinNole said:

Our local paper had an article today in which they interviewed a number of area restaurants and nearly all of them said that they would ease into fully opening...

What does "ease into" mean? They won't turn customers away because if they do people will be screaming "let me in." The question is how many customers show up.

[LXA350]

47 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

Explain Sweden for me - virtually no restrictions and the chart has flatlined.

 

If Sweden is doing that great not sure, they just stoped reporting their cases on regular basis as it seems.

[Goodtime Cruizin]

2 minutes ago, Pratique said:

What does "ease into" mean? They won't turn customers away because if they do people will be screaming "let me in." The question is how many customers show up.

 

No one should be turned away until they reach capacity. And this is a good thing. 

[not-enough-cruising]

3 minutes ago, Pratique said:

What does "ease into" mean? They won't turn customers away because if they do people will be screaming "let me in." The question is how many customers show up.

Of course they will turn people away if they have to, we have seen this in TX, and the amount of people showing up to eat in restaurants is nearly back to pre pandemic levels. 

[Goodtime Cruizin]

1 minute ago, LXA350 said:

 

If Sweden is doing that great not sure, they just stoped reporting their cases on regular basis as it seems.

 

It's called Leadership.  They effectively stopped the fear mongering. 

[not-enough-cruising]

17 minutes ago, Pratique said:

Voluntary behavior, something Americans apparently are not good at.

Not at all, Sweden just went about business as usual, no unnecessary fear mothering.  

Edited September 26, 2020 by not-enough-cruising

[Pratique]

Just now, not-enough-cruising said:

Not at all, Sweden just went about business as usual 

That's not what they are saying happened. Sweden is crowing about civic responsibility to take precautions. But the book is not yet closed on their story yet.

[Wine-O]

22 minutes ago, Pratique said:

Voluntary behavior, something Americans apparently are not good at.

 

Yeah, we're just a bunch of sheeple.  LOL  🍷

[Pratique]

4 minutes ago, Wine-O said:

 

Yeah, we're just a bunch of sheeple.  LOL  🍷

Sheeple might work though! https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbreak-sweden-stockholm-death-rates-europe-a01ddfa2e8ef839b2ee05e2cbcd63169

 

Quote

While the rest of the world watched with envy at the freedoms that Swedes enjoyed amid lockdowns elsewhere, there were not as many as people have assumed. Gatherings were capped at 50, and congregating at bars was banned.

Most of the changes involved voluntary actions by citizens, rather than rules imposed by the government.

This trust given to the population to shoulder personal responsibility in the pandemic puts Sweden at odds with most other countries that used coercive measures such as fines to force compliance.

Edited September 26, 2020 by Pratique

[LXA350]

8 minutes ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

 

It's called Leadership.  They effectively stopped the fear mongering. 

 

This is the biggest mistake, which actually was done as well in the US. Letting the population believe the virus is not serious. We shuld not all get into panic, but everyone needs to be caucious especially with hygiene measures and mask wearing in public, together with social distancing. Only these things help to keep things under control and not to get things going out of control. Best examples, where this happened would be France and Spain in Europe and Israel in the Middle East for instance.

[BND]

47 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

If anybody cares about actual Florida data, here it is.  Positive cases per day pretty constant in September but deaths have declined daily throughout the month.  Three counties in SE FL, Tampa and Orlando areas are the most affected.  They also happen to include the cruise ports we use.

 

https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/96dd742462124fa0b38ddedb9b25e429

There's a few schools of thought on the death rate.  One is that a lot of people are asymptomatic but being tested anyway, and some repeatedly.   Another is that as the virus mutates, it becomes more contagious, but less deadly.  The third is that they are learning how to treat it (steroids in particular) and ventilators are being avoided as much as possible (high death rate if you go on ventilator).  

 

DH and I are getting ready to go to a local cidery.  We plan to be there at noon when they open and sit outside.  And, this afternoon my oldest DS and DDIL will be coming by after they visit my MIL at her senior apartment (they wear masks there).  We keep our distance.  DDIL is an RN and is working this am in the office.  She showers when she gets home from work.  We've gotten together with both our DS and DDIL's several times in the last 6 months.  We avoid hugging and keep out of each other's faces.  You have to live some semblance of a normal life while still staying safe.  But, crowded cruise ports in highly infected areas are a high risk so who knows what will happen in the next few weeks.

[Iamcruzin]

46 minutes ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

I’m glad you are getting apart but the 10’ pole is ridiculous. Be responsible for you. Don’t depend on anyone else but you. sorry. 

Like you we are responsible. It’s everyone else who thinks they can arrive at the beach later in the day and think that they can just sit anywhere and ignore the rule. We spread out with blankets and chairs so even if someone comes close we still maintain a distance. We are beach hogs. If everyone was responsible there wouldn’t be a need to police the situation. As you know that has never been the case even on a good day.

[Goodtime Cruizin]

7 minutes ago, LXA350 said:

 

This is the biggest mistake, which actually was done as well in the US. Letting the population believe the virus is not serious. We shuld not all get into panic, but everyone needs to be caucious especially with hygiene measures and mask wearing in public, together with social distancing. Only these things help to keep things under control and not to get things going out of control. Best examples, where this happened would be France and Spain in Europe and Israel in the Middle East for instance.

 

I disagree. 

[cured]

1 hour ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

Take care of yourself. Be responsible for you. 
 

M8

This is the only place I disagree with you.  Our great country used to be "Do it for us" when hard times befell us.  We used to band together to protect the more vulnerable in society.  Now it is sadly an everyone for themselves attitude. That is not who we are. It is why so many countries have travel bans against us.  Nobody trusts this country to do the right thing and follow health protocols.

 

I am 100% in agreement on opening up...with masks.  Pretty much every single scientist out there has said that masks work. Fauci and a group of scientists said just this month that if everyone wore masks for 6-12 weeks, we would have this under control.

 

And I agree because I have seen it work. Our state has a mandatory mask order.  We have a 95% compliance rate.  I live in a major metropolitan area and our numbers are less than 2.5%.  And we  have/are starting to open. Our schools open next month. Bars and restaurants are open with some restrictions like time and table spacing. My neighbor's kids have been playing little league all summer (with their masks on.) Our local swim team held their meets all summer (masks worn up to the blocks and then put on again after the race.) High school and college sports start a shortened season in October.  Is it perfect? Absolutely not.  Service industries are still struggling.  But masks have brought the numbers way down, allowing us to resume normal activities without spikes.

 

I know you said you wear masks, but there are still too many people that feel a mask is not a health object to protect yourself and others, but some sort of political statement about their rights. They don't care about every other citizen, only themselves. 

 

 

[HxFx]

33 minutes ago, Pratique said:

What does "ease into" mean? They won't turn customers away because if they do people will be screaming "let me in." The question is how many customers show up.

Even when restaurants are running at full capacity the limit will get reached. I've never seen people screaming when a restaurant tells someone they don't have any room to seat them. Best optics would be to move any tables that are beyond a restaurant's comfortable capacity out of sight/out of a functional setup.

[ZoeyVictoria]

1 hour ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

I’m not a fan of the beach but if I went, I would probably not wear a mask as long as I could avoid others in close proximity. I don’t wear a mask in my car either. 

We moved close to the beach six weeks ago and have gone to the beach once a week.  We get there early and watch as others arrive.  There has always been at least twenty feet between groups both on the beach and in the water.  We leave by noon, so it is possible that changes in the afternoon.  We never wear masks on the beach, but always everywhere else.  

[islandwannabee]

Here's the problem with leaving people to do what's right.  I am in the Tampa Bay Area, granddaughter had swim meet last night, we got there early, ground was marked with x's on where you could place your chairs, 6' apart. Great got a good seat. Well here comes everyone at the last minute just crowding everywhere, so no more 6' rule. If I wanted to move, it would be way out yonder where I couldn't see anything. So even though you try and do the right thing, a lot of other people do not.

[Roger88]

Good news, but I would not keep all the optimism to myself. The news are keep coming about the second wave and places being locked down again. I would suggest not taking these news for granted. You never know, they might close it again the next day 

[John&LaLa]

1 hour ago, cured said:

Off topic, but that must be SO cool to be able to watch on a regular basis.  We have considered purchasing a vacation condo in your area just to be able to be close to Kennedy as we have an offspring in the industry. It seems like the perfect area, ships, rockets and ocean.

 

2022 is going to be cool when Blue Origin (Jeff Bezos) starts flying the massive New Glenn. 

 

And what's really special is we have direct line of site to the launch/landing pad. 

[Pratique]

28 minutes ago, Iamcruzin said:

If everyone was responsible there wouldn’t be a need to police the situation. As you know that has never been the case even on a good day.

 

8 minutes ago, islandwannabee said:

So even though you try and do the right thing, a lot of other people do not.

This and this are why we need rules. Americans are headstrong by nature.

 

22 minutes ago, HxFx said:

Even when restaurants are running at full capacity the limit will get reached. I've never seen people screaming when a restaurant tells someone they don't have any room to seat them. Best optics would be to move any tables that are beyond a restaurant's comfortable capacity out of sight/out of a functional setup.

I have seen people getting upset when some Covid-related restriction is interfering with what they consider "normal." When the government required the restriction, the customers could go pound sand. But without the restrictions, the restaurant employees have to explain that it is their "policy," and some people don't like that.

 

The solution might be to require restaurants to install barriers between tables. That is now required here in New Hampshire if restaurants want to run at 100% and don't have 6-foot separation. But whether the restaurants would be willing to install the barriers without a government mandate is an open question. Maybe yes, maybe no.

[BND]

13 minutes ago, islandwannabee said:

Here's the problem with leaving people to do what's right.  I am in the Tampa Bay Area, granddaughter had swim meet last night, we got there early, ground was marked with x's on where you could place your chairs, 6' apart. Great got a good seat. Well here comes everyone at the last minute just crowding everywhere, so no more 6' rule. If I wanted to move, it would be way out yonder where I couldn't see anything. So even though you try and do the right thing, a lot of other people do not.

That is more than Covid related.  People do that all the time at parades, sporting events, etc.  It's called entitlement.  It's the "I show up when I want and I can sit where I want, even if it's blocking you" because they are more important and don't care that you took the time to be early for a good seat as they "deserve" it too.  Sound familiar?  "I paid for my cruise so I should get special treatment" mentality that we see.  So glad that so far, every place we've been people have kept their distance.  Except for the jerk at the beach hotel we were at in July (the guy had his kids with him) who came up to my husband and wanted to fist bump him.  Idiot, and then when my DH didn't/wouldn't, he called him an a hole-great example to his children.  It's that mentality that's the problem and it bleeds into all aspects of  life.

[islandwannabee]

I could easily see this happening on a cruise ship that leaves out of the U.S Ports. They fix the chairs on the pool deck so you are not on top of everyone, all well and good, except when people come and it gets crowded, they will move chairs and just sit where they want, after all it is their vacation. Let's not even start on the elevator. 

[Keksie]

16 minutes ago, Pratique said:

 

This and this are why we need rules. Americans are headstrong by nature.

 

 

How many rules are you willing to live with?  Wear a mask, socially distance, close down your business, go on unemployment, take out your pool and hot tub, don't swim in a lake or a pool, get rid of your boat, take out all the trees around your home, take public transportation, only eat healthy foods in healthy portions, don't smoke anything, don't drink alcohol over a certain amount etc.  These are all safety measures which ones do you want a rule for?