Predict when cruising will start again post-Coronavirus

[Pushka]

A long, and quite damning review of the manner in which cruise lines didnt listen to the warnings

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/politics/cruise-ships-coronavirus/?itid=hp_hp-top-table-high_cruisefallout-1020am%3Ahomepage%2Fstory-ans

[christodan]

I think this is a pretty biased piece. For example, 

 

"We knew there was an epidemic with international potential,” said Ted Cohen, an epidemiologist at Yale School of Public Health who examined data gathered by The Post, adding: “It was irresponsible for the industry to not be proactive in how to limit these activities in times of global crisis.”

 

I find this quite unfair, as if a cruise company is supposed to have a crystal ball and be experts in new viruses. That is the epidemiologist's job, not the cruise ship's. 

 

Second quote:"

Carmen Cruz, who owns the ambulance company that transported her to a hospital, said the dispatcher told local medical personnel that the woman possibly had pneumonia — but that covid-19 was not suspected.

“As soon as they described the symptoms, we said, ‘This is covid-19,’ ” Cruz said. “They described it saying ‘No, that this was pneumonia, and she had a history of respiratory issues.’ ” At the time, Puerto Rico had no other confirmed cases of the illness.

 

This is coming from someone who hasn't personally seen covid-19 in person before, but  can diagnose without testing? She later said "the woman’s symptoms were clearly consistent with the coronavirus. “A rooster could not sing more loudly.” "

No DOCTOR would diagnose just by looking at someone, but the OWNER of an AMBULANCE COMPANY can diagnose just by looking at them and it's clear as a rooster crowing? Absolutely ridiculous. I expected better from the Washington Post.

 

 

[lyndarra]

1 hour ago, Pushka said:

A long, and quite damning review of the manner in which cruise lines didnt listen to the warnings

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/politics/cruise-ships-coronavirus/?itid=hp_hp-top-table-high_cruisefallout-1020am%3Ahomepage%2Fstory-ans

How easy it is to forget the general attitude of people, country leaders, cruise operators at the time. At that time, early February, most of us here on this forum were still thinking and planning cruises to be had over the next couple of months. How naive we all were. A lot of finger pointing going on now but they're all pointing at their own glass houses.

[Pushka]

19 minutes ago, lyndarra said:

How easy it is to forget the general attitude of people, country leaders, cruise operators at the time. At that time, early February, most of us here on this forum were still thinking and planning cruises to be had over the next couple of months. How naive we all were. A lot of finger pointing going on now but they're all pointing at their own glass houses.

A lot of that early piece centered on late March. And when the cruise fleet was grounded in the US, one Celebrity ship beat the lockdown by an hour or so and which was much celebrated. I think that was the cruise mentioned in this article and where people became ill. 
 

Not in hindsight for us. As soon as Princess Diamond happened we started working out the best way to cancel our Edge Med Cruise in July. We had already reorganised flights so as not to transit through Hong Kong but that Diamond Cruise was the last nail. 

[mr walker]

2 hours ago, Pushka said:

As soon as Princess Diamond happened we started working out the best way to cancel our Edge Med Cruise in July. 

 

The scenes and reports of Diamond Princess were enough for us also. We were booked for Voyager OTS 30-March, and made up our mind we would not be going. At that stage it was still on, and I was seeking out where we stood re travel insurance.

Mar10 we decided we would not be going, just working on exit strategy to see if we could not lose our money totally. Around 12th March, RC announced their Sale with Confidence offer and so we went for the FCC option. Not too long after (15th) RCI pulled the plug on the cruise.

[DiamondFour]

I guess we are likely to have some indication next Friday of the future cruise situation in Australia.

 

For what its worth I do not believe that it will restart in America this year at all. With reports of their citizens protesting their freedoms and being the worst hit country in the world their recovery is going to take longer. The rest of the world will not open their borders to them until they get their mess under control and for us that means we will not be letting them in as well as their neighbouring countries either.

 

If Europe gets their act together and eradicates it over the summer to an extent that cases can be contained and isolated then cruising will resume in Europe before America but there will be no Americans going to Europe.

 

As for Australia it is up to our government.

 

The worst case scenario is cruises starting in Asia first namely china which is what Carnival and Royal Caribbean predict will happen. If that is the case any ship that goes to, departs from or finishes in china or any of its territories will be off my list entirely.

[MMDown Under]

Are those small ships still around NZ?

[icat2000]

Can't see cruising commencing in Australia until 2021. 

[pully8]

Who knows but as we know some lines were more infection prone than others.

So many factors including possible risk of infection at ports of call.

The crowding and perhaps the dining arrangements could be improved, less self service?

We like to escape the heat at Christmas and enjoy Europe however that may not be possible this year. 

 

[christodan]

7 hours ago, pully8 said:

Who knows but as we know some lines were more infection prone than others.

So many factors including possible risk of infection at ports of call.

The crowding and perhaps the dining arrangements could be improved, less self service?

We like to escape the heat at Christmas and enjoy Europe however that may not be possible this year. 

 

 

It only boils down to if someone brought it on board with them or not. It seems as though this is so infectious that it would be impossible to stop the spread. So I don't know how much improving the crowding and dining will guarantee that it will not spread. The only way that it will be safe is if everyone gets tested before embarking.I think it takes three days to get results of the COVID test at the moment. Maybe the cruise lines could get everyone to test in the days before embarking and send through the results. Just like we do an online check in now before embarking, this could be an added requirement.

[Pushka]

24 minutes ago, christodan said:

 

It only boils down to if someone brought it on board with them or not. It seems as though this is so infectious that it would be impossible to stop the spread. So I don't know how much improving the crowding and dining will guarantee that it will not spread. The only way that it will be safe is if everyone gets tested before embarking.I think it takes three days to get results of the COVID test at the moment. Maybe the cruise lines could get everyone to test in the days before embarking and send through the results. Just like we do an online check in now before embarking, this could be an added requirement.

They are trying to do a rapid test that gives results in an hour or so. I'm not sure if they still need to ascertain accuracy. 

[Kiwi Kruzer]

I think the problem is that the virus does not show up while it’s incubating . 

[christodan]

Hmm. Well maybe everyone will have to get tested say on the 3rd or 4th day of the cruise as well. 

We can't  just live life as though there is zero risk as there's always risk in everything we do.  

[MicCanberra]

3 minutes ago, christodan said:

Hmm. Well maybe everyone will have to get tested say on the 3rd or 4th day of the cruise as well. 

We can't  just live life as though there is zero risk as there's always risk in everything we do.  

Every port stop?

 

[christodan]

No I'm just talking about the TransTasman Bubble at the moment.

Edited May 2, 2020 by christodan
typo

[The_Big_M]

3 hours ago, MicCanberra said:

Every port stop?

 

 

Before dinner.

 

Agreed there's no zero risk approach. Not sure we need to aim for that though. We don't aim for zero risk with the flu, so this comes back to people taking the appropriate measures depending on the risk.

[MicCanberra]

6 minutes ago, The_Big_M said:

 

Before dinner.

 

Agreed there's no zero risk approach. Not sure we need to aim for that though. We don't aim for zero risk with the flu, so this comes back to people taking the appropriate measures depending on the risk.

Agreed.

[pully8]

We also need to consider the possibility of the virus and others remaining on hard shiny surfaces.

Enhanced cleaning protocols may assist.

Another is the staff coming and going and their health status.

Keen to get travelling again and believe we will see changes.

Also wondering about passports, given ban on use will they be extended if the ban continues for say more than a year? 

[Blackduck59]

I'm pretty sure that there will be no "extension" to passports, the "expiry" date is written in stone or at least clearly printed on the numbered page they won't be extended. Keep in mind they like you to have had it for a number of months before you travel and they want you to have at least six months left on it when you return to your home country so really if you have a five year passport it's really only good for 4 1/2 years, ten year 9 1/2. Yes it's a scam, governments do that often🤔

[MicCanberra]

Passports will expire as per their expiry date whether used or not, just like before.

 

[pully8]

Frustrating not to get value for what you pay for. Many unintended consequences. 

A bit like health insurance premiums, not deferred despite not being able to claim or have service/treatment, unless considered emergency as determined by the government emergency measures.

Can claim telemed but not possible for dental or surgical procedures.

We do not deal with flightcentre but pleased to see ACCC have ruled they cannot charge people as they have been.  

[By The Bay]

18 hours ago, pully8 said:

Also wondering about passports, given ban on use will they be extended if the ban continues for say more than a year? 

I cannot see that happening. It would require passports to be returned and updated to new expiry date.

[MicCanberra]

13 hours ago, pully8 said:

Frustrating not to get value for what you pay for. Many unintended consequences. 

A bit like health insurance premiums, not deferred despite not being able to claim or have service/treatment, unless considered emergency as determined by the government emergency measures.

Can claim telemed but not possible for dental or surgical procedures.

We do not deal with flightcentre but pleased to see ACCC have ruled they cannot charge people as they have been.  

Yes, the costs of living have gone up but it is better than the alternative.

[GUT2407]

I suspect the first cruises will be ANZACS only with bars still in place on foreign tourists.

[The_Big_M]

4 minutes ago, GUT2407 said:

I suspect the first cruises will be ANZACS only with bars still in place on foreign tourists.

 

I thought the bars would be in place for the ANZACs (well, Australians anyway).